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Starting Suboxone, scared to death!!!
  1. #1
    JMAlv is offline Member
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    Default Starting Suboxone, scared to death!!!

    My backstory is the same as everyone else's so I will try to keep it short. My husband and I started using Lortab recreationally 4 years ago and progressed to where we are now: 240-320 mg OC/day. Once the forumla changed to OP and the days of putting it up our noses were gone, we started talking about quitting. We've tried cold turkey twice and failed on the third day both times. Neither of us have insurance but we do have access to 140 of the 8 mg Suboxone.

    I have read all of the threads here on Suboxone, studied them, printed some of them out. My husband and I would not be taking this on if I had not found this message board. I have printed out Robert's "Suboxone/subutex therapy" instructions, as well as the worksheet to make sure we don't start too early. I have been really excited about this, knowing that we are going to take back control of our lives and will no longer be blowing $6000+/month on these stupid pills.

    Now that the time is here, I am scared to death! I just took my last OC (240 mg OC plus 30 mg morphine today) and I'm done. I'm going to try to enjoy my last high (though this low of a dosage doesn't really get me high anymore) and wait for the right time to take my first Suboxone.
    There are two things I'm scared of...1. Waiting until the right time to take my first dose. I understand 100% that we need to be in moderately severe withdrawl for this to work properly. I've been to that point a few times and I hate it!! Can we take xanax before then or do we need to be 100% free of EVERY drug between now and when we start? I know we will start to feel bad this time tomorrow but the major withdrawls should not get bad until sometime Tuesday morning. We are going to hold out as long as possible, using the worksheet as our guide. I know how I'm going to feel between this time tomorrow and Tuesday morning before my first dose and I am so scared of that feeling.
    2. My second fear is will I do this right? I am going to want to put an end to my OC withdrawls as quickly as possible once they get severe. I am reading to try starting at 2 mg and working up from there once an hour if it does not work. I'm scared to do this because I don't want to wait hour after hour until I find the right dose. Can I start at 4 mg or is that a really bad idea? I guess what I'm asking is what, exactly, do I do the first day. I am NOT going to go over 8mg, as I have read everything here and know that is bad. Am I reading it right that on day 1, we take the full dose and then wait 24 hours for the next dose, splitting it in half? As in... day 1 we say we need say 8 (just as an example) so we take that whole dose and wait 24 hours. On day two, we take 4 mg in the morning and another 4 mg that evening. Is that correct?

    If you are still reading, thank you! I did not intend to make this such a long post. I am really worried about this but so many people have shared success stories. I have more ?'s but I don't want to overwhelm anyone willing to help. Just one more for now: Does the Suboxone really stop the icky feelings of withdrawl? The vomiting, the shaking, the leg kicking, the creepy crawly feeling all over your skin? We have 4 kids and were going to do Suboxone at different times so at least one of us could stay on oxy and function while the other one does the Suboxone but we've decided to do it together because we think we will be more successful.

    Anyone willing to answer my questions, offer advice or support will be greatly appreciated!! Knowing I'm not alone really helps. My husband does not get online to read and post like I do but I do tell him everything that I read. We are going to look for at least 1-2 NA meetings to attend starting this week, too.

    Thanks, again!
    Jen

  2. #2
    Robert_325 is offline Diamond Elite
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    Jen ...... I will be happy to induct you both right here as I've done LOTS of times before. If you printed the COWS worksheet from the sub therapy link then you know you guys have to be at a score of 26 or higher to avoid precipitated w/d. Trust me you don't want to have that happen to you.

    Stay in touch with me the next 24 hours and if you want me to help you let me know. The induction is the most important part getting you off to the right start at the lowest effective dose. That is done by inducting you the right way only. Do it wrong and you can turn into a horror story, do it right and it's not that hard. You have PLENTY of subs to get you both completely through this whole deal.

    I can have you both totally clean including the subs if you do as I ask over the next 60 days. Hope that helps ease your mind. God bless.
    Last edited by Anonymous; 04-17-2011 at 05:44 PM.

  3. #3
    JMAlv is offline Member
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    Default Yes, please!!

    Robert, we are very grateful for your offer to help! Thank you so much. We have both taken our last dose and now are just trying to enjoy our last high and wait until it's time for induction. I have read so many posts about your help and I am so happy to have it. I'm looking forward to being another success story with your help. I feel less nervous about this all since you have offered to help. Thank you.

    I am prescribed 3 mg of xanax a day. Can I continue to take that as prescribed while taking suboxone or should I cut that back?

    Thank you!

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    Robert_325 is offline Diamond Elite
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    Quote Originally Posted by JMAlv View Post
    Robert, we are very grateful for your offer to help! Thank you so much. We have both taken our last dose and now are just trying to enjoy our last high and wait until it's time for induction. I have read so many posts about your help and I am so happy to have it. I'm looking forward to being another success story with your help. I feel less nervous about this all since you have offered to help. Thank you.

    I am prescribed 3 mg of xanax a day. Can I continue to take that as prescribed while taking suboxone or should I cut that back?

    Thank you!



    How long have you taken the xanax? Is that 3mg accurate daily or do you take it however you feel like it?

    Don't want you to take ANYTHING while waiting to start the induction. It will get you to a 26 score faster taking nothing. I'll answer about the xanax after you tell me your history with it.

    And you can both do this together as you won't be feeling badly during the time you use the subs if you use them like I ask you to do. God bless.

  5. #5
    Cleanisgood is offline New Member
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    Default Jen dont worry!!!

    Jen, I was scared too! I was real scared my 1st day of Suboxone. This is what i did. Maybe this will work for you too, I took my last Roxy at 9pm on a Tuesday...then did absolutly NO more opiates. I took a xanax and went to sleep. That next morning (Wenesday) i waited. and Im used to doing a 30mg (roxy) in the mornings. sometimes more.. but i didnt take anyopiates just a 1mg xanax that morning. They say to wait about 24 hours after your last dose of opiate. Or until you start the w/ds. I went to work and everything! I was so scared!!! Trust me i was freaking out! What if it doesnt work?! what if i get sick as hell?!? You cant do the what ifs tho. Just jump into it and stay positive! K so when i stated feeling the stomach cramps i took a full 8mg strip (Suboxone) and i just kept telling myself im gonna be okay im gonna be okay!! It was still on my mind tho cause i was really scared! So needless to say it was a freakin MIRACLE!!! I didnt feel sick at all! I went on serving my tables however i did take a Xanax about an hour after my 1st sub. (I still take the xanax cause my anxiety is terrible!!! So im assuming as long as you wait an hour or so you can still take xanax) since the day ive started Suboxone (today is day 5!! ) i havent felt any sign of w/d! I can sleep i can eat, work, function!!! I think you and your husband should do it together you can still function. The suboxone like takes ALLLLLL the bad away and it makes you feel sooo good cause youre thinking how can i feel this good without my drugs! It really is amazing and you will see that theres nothing for you to be scared about just go ahead and start the subs when your w/d start, The 1st day i took to much in my opinion, i took an 8mg strip and then a little later i cut a strip in half and took 4mg then at night i was scared and wanted to sleep and not w/d so i took another 8. but you dont need that much! maybe one 8mg and then at night 4mgs. the 2nd day i took 4mg in the morning and 4mg at night then the 3rd day the same. 4th day 2mg in the morning and 2 at night and today.. the 5th day i did the same. i really dont know when i should stop the suboxone tho and if im taking to much?!?! But i hope this helps Jen! Good luck to you and your husband, my Fiance and I are doing this together and we feel GREAT!!!

  6. #6
    JMAlv is offline Member
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    I was prescribed xanax over a year ago. I guess I need to go back to 1st grade because I can't add. I am prescribed 4mg/day, not 3. That is 1 mg in the morning, 1 mg in the afternoon and 2 mg before bed. I really don't like xanax but it does help with my anxiety. It is rare that I take more than 2 mg/day, it is usually less. Most often, I take .5 mg around 2 pm and then 1 mg right before I lie down to go to sleep, usually around midnight-1 am. The only time I've taken more is if I'm feeling extra stressed. I try to get by on as little Xanax as possible because I have never liked mixing it with my pills.

    As for my history with pills, the original OC was my drug of choice but since the formula was changed, I have been taking the OP version, as well as Opana, Roxi, Percs and Morphine, depending on what is available each day. At first, I was depressed when the new OCs came out but now I see it as a blessing. They have really given me that extra push I've needed to really, truly want to quit for good. My husband has been wanting to quit for quite sometime but it's hard when your partner isn't ready.

    I tend to talk a lot so I hope that does not run you off. I feel like the more I talk and the more open I am about it, the more successful I will be. I'm not that talkative and open in person. What is your opinion on NA? I don't think I would feel as comfortable talking in person but he is wanting to go and I have no problem going and listening. I have found a meeting tomorrow. Is that too soon to go? We will be in mild withdrawl at that point, nothing too bad yet.

    I can't say thank you enough. Each time I read one of your posts and reply to you, I get a little less nervous.


    Jen

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    JMAlv is offline Member
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    Cleanisgood, THANK YOU! What and how much were you guys taking before you started suboxone? If you have the time, I would love a small update from you each day to see how it is going for you and your fiance. Whew! The more positive stories like yours that I read, the better I feel!! Thank you sooooo much!


    Robert has an amazing plan to follow that has nothing but rave reviews. I did not save the link to it because I printed it out but if he stops back in tonight, I'm sure he can provide the link.

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    JMAlv is offline Member
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    Did I start this thread in the correct topic area or should I move it someplace else? I just noticed this is not the original section I did all of the reading at.

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    Robert_325 is offline Diamond Elite
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    Jen ........ I will post the link to the sub therapy post below in case anyone needs it. I need you to follow what I'm telling you though and don 't be taking any 12mg at induction as others with less experience may tell you. I know how to do this in the manner that will work best. I've done this a thousand times at least. 12mg is probably three times too much as you'll see, and you NEVER take an 8mg strip at once. You will be doing this 1mg and 2mg MAX at a time during induction. We want you on the lowest effective dose and I know how to get you there if you do as I ask. You can leave this post in this location. It's just fine here. God bless.

    https://www.drugs.com/forum/featured...apy-50887.html

    CleanIsGood ...... I will be happy to help you guys too if you want me too. It's hard doing things the right way without the proper direction. I know you were just trying to help above. Don't take me harshly, I only mean the best for you too. God bless.
    Last edited by Anonymous; 04-17-2011 at 11:06 PM.

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    JMAlv is offline Member
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    Robert, we are following your plan 100%. I've seen how many people you have helped and I totally trust you. I expect to start feeling bad tomorrow evening but I don't expect to be in the moderately severe w/d until sometime Tuesday morning just based on past experience.
    I'm here and ready for your instructions. Thank you!

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    JMAlv is offline Member
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    I'm heading to bed now... a little scared of what tomorrow will bring in order to get to that 26 on the worksheet but knowing it will be worth it. Robert, I will post updates throughout the day on how we're feeling and await your recommendation on how to dose for the first time once we get to 26.

    Thank you!
    Jen

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    JMAlv is offline Member
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    6:15 a.m. ~ I am up as usual to get the kids ready for school. I usually have to drive them but I am dealing with the stress of a broken down car (we only have one) so I am goin to go back to bed in an hour because someone is coming to pick them up. I will sleep until noon and I'm scared of how I will feel when I wake back up because that is usually when I take my first pill of the day. I'm not feeling as happy about all of this today but I WILL do it.

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    JMAlv is offline Member
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    Who am I kidding? I'm fighting back the tears the best I can but they are flowing now. I went in the bathroom and gave myself a few minutes to get it together before the kids all come downstairs. I am so freaking depressed. Yes, I'm ready. I want those pills out of ourr lives. I want that extra $6000/month for things like a second car! I just know what the next 24 hours hold and I am worried. I'm also worried about who I will be off drugs. This has been a daily thing for 4 years. In that 4 years, I quit the gym and gained 40+ pounds, aged 15+ years, become lazy and moody... quitting is for the best. I know it. I just can't get over being scared wondering how life is going to be without pills?

    *****Does subox help the mental side of this, too, or is it just for the physical symptoms?

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    JMAlv is offline Member
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    1:30 pm, feeling restless, depressed and stomach slowly starting to bother me.. minor, minor w/d but enough to make me glad my car is in the shop right now or I would be tempted to go buy oc! i hate this and it has not even gotten bad yet

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    Robert_325 is offline Diamond Elite
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    Jen ...... W/D from opiates makes us feel like we are going to die, but we won't. You can do this! I was taking over 100 pills a day when I stopped, I had used for 35 years, so believe me I know the drill. That was almost 9 years ago that I finally got clean so it can be done.

    Remember that you only have to do this ONE TIME if you do it right like I'm telling you to do. I promise that I know how to do this the right way. We will get you guys clean but you have to go through this little minor inconvience prior to induction.

    I mean isn't this a worthwhile price to pay to have your life back? You'll be able to be a good mom for your kids, have a life again that you are proud of yourself over. This is NOTHING in comparison to the rewards! Like my first NA sponsor told me,"You're worst day clean is better than your best day using." God bless.

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    JMAlv is offline Member
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    yes, yes, yes..... thank you!! my husband is a little stronger than i am because he has been wanting to quit for a long time. this was sort of just pushed on me but I am ready. I have usually had 1 OC and a few roxi, morphine or opana by now so we're heading in the right direction. I expect to hit that 26 sometime after midnight tonight. I keep telling my husband that i am going to wait to be more of a 30 but is that necessary to wait that little bit of extra?

    also, since i fear induction will be sometime between midnight and 6 a,m,, will you be able to leave instructions before you go to bed? I'm not totally positive how many mg to start with. I'm thinking 2mg then add 1-2mg every hour until we find the minimum dose that gets rid of w/d? I would be so thrilled to start at 6mg, rather than 8 mg because that means less time on subs! I want off of subs asap but not until my body is fully ready.

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    Robert_325 is offline Diamond Elite
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    Jen ........ We have a tendancy when we are inducting ourselves to cut ourselves too much slack. It's natural as we are in bad w/d. Trust me if you were in a rehab waiting for induction the staff would have you thinking you were on the verge of death needing to go to the hospital before you got inducted if they knew what they were doing.

    I won't be going to bed early tonight so check in with me about 11:00 or so. I'm on CST, live in TX so you'll know for your time zone. Let's see how you're doing then. What time zone are you guys?

    If you could make it till morning I would have you feeling better than you've felt since high school if I induct you myself I promise! And it would only take us a couple hours or so. It's ONE night to deal with misery, but it will be so worth it when you are feeling great on a tiny dose. I have even inducted people at less than 2mg several times. The average is 3-4mg when I do it. Talk with your husband and then we'll talk tonight.

    Sure I will give you the induction instructions tonight if you insist on doing it yourself. But I don't want you to jump the gun and think you're worse than you are and have you end up in precipitated w/d. If that happens you WILL feel like you're dying. It's so much worse than you feel at a 26 on that COWS worksheet. Scoring 26 is a minimum. I would really like to do this together with you guys to be sure. If you wait till you're really ready you'll be cussing me and ready to tell me to go to hell before I tell you to begin. I'll know when you are ready, trust me!

    We will talk tonight. Remember that I'm trying to help you and I've inducted more people than I can count and I have NEVER put anyone in precipitated w/d. It's only when they do it themselves and start too soon that it happens. I know how to do this .... induction is an art and I'm,good not to brag. It's your call ultimately. But if you allow me to induct you and follow along afterwards with all of the suggestions I give you this will be so much easier than you can imagine. God bless.
    Last edited by Anonymous; 04-18-2011 at 02:48 PM.

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    JMAlv is offline Member
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    Anything you say... I trust you. I pretty much assumed I need to get to where I've been before. On the floor BEGGING to go to the ER. I'll check back in tonight when it starts to get bad and again tomorrow morning as it starts to get unbearable. Thank you.

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    Robert_325 is offline Diamond Elite
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    Let's see how you feel tonight. Who knows you may be ready, I can't say yet. But we will know tonight what we need to do. What part of the country do you live so I'll know your time difference?

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    JMAlv is offline Member
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    est... I'm in the south and on the east coast.... wrapped up in a blanket b/c the goosebumps have started, from head to toe... still VERY minor w/d. I've tried this enough to know the vomiting, sweats, etc... don't get bad until the second day, though it may be different this time, who knows... getting pretty irritable. By this time of day, I am usually on my 2nd and 3rd oc together, as well as a decent amount of something else, usually snorted roxi for a second time today, too, by now.

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    JMAlv is offline Member
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    5:30, it's been 24 hours since we last took anything. I am at a score of 23, in moderate w/d. not sure where hubsand is because we're pretty much avoiding each other but from observing him, he is close to the same, maybe a little tiny bit higher. if this is a 23, i'm pretty certain i can hold out to around a 30. main issue so far are covered in goosboose, major runny nose, can't stop crying (typing through a ton of tears), facw flushed and hot though I have chills, feelings of nausea (sp? would normally care but not right now) and irritability. I can handle all of this.... it is when I start feeling my sking "crawl" (if that makes sense?) and uncontrollable vomiting that I can't take it anymore.
    I WILL follow your advice and wait until you sau we're ready, as well as what dosage to start with. Like I said in the beginning, I talk alot.

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    JMAlv is offline Member
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    Please forgive my MANY typos... tying and crying don't mix well

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    Robert_325 is offline Diamond Elite
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    I don't care about typos! We maybe can do this tonight. Sounds like you're closer than waiting till tomorrow morning. We may make a late night out of this though doing it tonight as I won't leave you guys until you're totally stable and feeling well.

    Talk with me in a couple hours .... 7:30 your time. When you post to me then be as specific as you can about your symptoms. And tell me about his symptoms too SPECIFICALLY FOR BOTH OF YOU!!! Hang in there, you're getting closer. God bless.
    Last edited by Anonymous; 04-18-2011 at 04:55 PM.

  24. #24
    gutterboi is offline New Member
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    Smile using suboxone for first time

    I have read ur story and I would like to explain to you what you need to know. I started taking boxes back in july 2010. I was a 6 80s a day and 10 30s, a day guy for most my life, even used >>>>>> for a time. I know what it feels like comming off. rest asure that u know have a miriacle drug in your hand, its better then 10 80s a day, believe it or not. the buripinepherin is better than >>>>>>, its just that the nayloxone is the blocker and will block most of the buripinepherin so u will get high as a kite, and only try 2mg at a time, me and my girl will do a 1/4 and she gets rocked, as for me I just maintain, I can get high if I want to, and believe me I do. Do not take benzos xanx, valume, because it will make you stop breathing, most if not all dr.s piss for benzos before u get them. It aint the end of the rode, i finally found a pill that makes me good and helps me make the right choieces. and you can take the boxes before with drawl during it dont matter, taken under the tounge it takes a half hour to work, snort it and it will work in 10 min. hope you understand

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    JMAlv is offline Member
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    7:45 I'm not there yet, still just below. However, I AM pissed and ready to give up. I feel like ???? but not enough like ???? to take it yet. I hate this! I'm more of a mental thing right now. As much as I'd like to fake it, I'm still only at a 23. yawning, fast heart rate, MAJOR irritable, covered in goosebumps, starting to have stomch issues but the creepy crawly skin thing has not started. I want a freakin roxi up my nose or something but I REFUSE to give in. Can't stop crying, either... this is a major mental mind ????.

  26. #26
    JMAlv is offline Member
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    BTW, we ended up with strips, not pills. Is that ok and can we still do it the way you planned, robert?

  27. #27
    HenryNCBA is offline Senior Member
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    Default Jen, Message from Robert

    Quote Originally Posted by JMAlv View Post
    Please forgive my MANY typos... tying and crying don't mix well
    Hello Jen,
    Henry here. Robert just called me to let me know that his and Melinda's Internet and also phone service crashed and hopefully they will be back up in an hour or so. If not I am able to help you also. I haven't read your posts yet but from the tone of your writings I can see that you are in a state of withdrawal. Robert stated that you are waiting to be inducted so that tells me that you have been off all medicaitons be it opiates, OTC pain meds, everything and waiting until you score a minimum of 26 on the COWS worksheet.
    Once you score a minimum of 26 we can start your induction but no sooner than that. You want to be in the peak of withdrawal and the worse you feel the better the induction will work and usually the lower your induction dosage. The purpose of this is to get you stabilized on the absolute minimum amount of sub necessary to get you stabilized. Do this right and after a few hours you will be feeling so much better you won't believe it.
    Keep us posted. Robert should be back in a bit if his service can get them back up and running. If not I will be here. I may not be able to post to you immediately as I am on the Pacific Coast and I will be leaving the office here shortly but will log in from home to check on you specifically.
    Jen, you will NOT be abandoned.
    Let us know where you stand and we may be able to get you started tonight. My understanding is you are most likely in GA or FL or there abouts so there is a substantial time difference but when you are not feeling well time is of no importance in getting you stabilized and feeling better.
    Hang in there and keep track of your COWS score. Don't cheat and please remember than the worse you feel the better this is going to work. Trust us it really does work.

    Henry

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    HenryNCBA is offline Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by JMAlv View Post
    BTW, we ended up with strips, not pills. Is that ok and can we still do it the way you planned, robert?
    Jen,
    Strips or pills doesn't matter. Either will work.

    Henry

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    JMAlv is offline Member
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    ????.... is that true about even low doses of xanax? I HATE xanax w/d... they can causes seizures! I have been on xanax for a long time and I can't just go off of it cold turkey. Should I wean from that first and then takes subox? I am so confused and SO worried!! I don't want to dies but I don't want seizures, either.

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    JMAlv is offline Member
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    Thanks, Henry. I've seen your posts before so I feel safe. I am STILL at a 23, husband is at a 21. I apologize for cussing in my last few posts. I am just in a terrible, rotten mood which is now worse due to the xanax thing. I need to know if that is true that I can't take them because I will need to wean off of those before I start subox. I can't risk seizures but I don't want to DIE doing this!! It has been 28 hours since I last took anything and experience tells me I will get in the 26-30 range by 4-5 a.m. I don't expect any of you to stay up that late with me so when you're to the point of not being able to wait with me any longer, please leave instructions and I will follow them when we PASS 26 and try to hold out to closer to a 30.

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