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getting off suboxone
  1. #331
    dmitrysm is offline New Member
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    I don't know if anyone reads this thread anymore-- but I want to point out one thing which is missing in all discussions of the subject.

    Without a doubt, a person can quit opiates. Surely, it is helpful for the rest of us still struggling with these drugs to hear the stories and encouragement from others who have quit. But lets be honest about it: in a purely abstract sense, a person can probably achieve almost anything they set their mind to, but practically, things are much more complicated.

    I've been on narcotics for 14 years, and have quit them and restarted them countless times. The difficulty of quitting is a variable factor. The most wicked habit -- 1/2 gram of straight dope per day, IV-- can be kicked cold turkey if you have a couple weeks of total freedom, a nice warm place, and someone to take care of you. On the other hand, even a mild addiction can be insurmountable if you can't take time off work, are stressed out, have depression, etc. Your mental state plays a huge role in your chances of success. That's why ibogaine works for people-- it is essentially a resetting of your mental state, your attitude, achieved with the help of a psychedelic drug which scrambles your expectations.

    With so many people today completely lacking direction and goals in their life, it is unavoidable that most drug addicts find nothing better than to go back to drugs. The life of an addict has a focus, however ridiculous this focus may be. If we were to be honest about drug addiction, we would recognize that it is unavoidable in a society which sacrifices things which are essential to human beings, such as interpersonal ties, cooperation, stable patterns of life among friends and neighbors, and worships qualities which drive people to the edge, such as competitiveness, "individualism," rootlessness, and a generally mercantilist view of life.

    Quitting narcotics, both in the immediate short-term sense and for the rest of your life, depends on how well your life is integrated into a meaningful social context. If you don't have friends and family who love and support you, and an environment in which you are valued and where you can thrive and grow, quitting will be that much more difficult. As will almost anything else you choose to pursue.

  2. #332
    iloerose is offline Platinum Member
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    Dmitri: That is the exact purpose of NA: to provide a social context with a group of people who share similar life experiences. NA is crucial to helping you change your habits and removing your focus on drugs. That is the singular factor that turns people back to drugs: What will my life be like w/o drugs? You cannot do this on your own. I did enjoy what you said in your post.

    Peace,

    Iloerose

  3. #333
    John-Paul Hutchings is offline New Member
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    I know that this is an old thread, but WTH does the poor guy's spelling have to do with the price of tea in China. I almost feel like throwing my proper grammar out the window just to bust your ignorant b@llz.

    First of all, you have no idea wth you are spewing! I can tell you for a fact that I know more about drugs and the intricacies of getting off of Suboxone, and i'm no doctor. I'm just a guy who has been on methadone for 10 straight years, got off of that, and went on Sub. The trick IS XANAX. But don't get yourself addicted to that in the process of getting off of the Sub. It makes tapering amazingly easy. Doctors don't have all the answers and every patient has their own physical quirks. Everyone is different, but generally, what i've said is the truth, and I don't care what you say about it. Get off of your high horse. Fricking Douchebag.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vicissitude View Post
    Forgetting about your atrocious spelling and grammar for a moment, your information is completely false. Tapering should ONLY, and let me repeat ONLY be monitored by a certified doctor, whether it be an opioid or an agonist like Suboxone or Subutex.

    If done correctly, coming off of Suboxone is so much easier than coming off opioids. I did it quite easily with the help of my doctor. Spewing out what you experienced doesn't make it right. You definitely did not use the proper medical protocol to try (and that would go for all of you who have posted about Suboxone withdrawal).
    Iwantoff2013 likes this.

  4. #334
    guts5460 is offline New Member
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    Hi all,
    I have been on suboxone for 2 1/2 years now for treatment of pain killer addiction. Unfortunately I lost my job last month along with my insurance. I am trying to wean myself off of this expensive treatment. This site seems very helpful yet confusing, because of the difference of dosages. I am prescribed to 2 and 1/2 of the 8 mg/2 mg films per day. I've been cutting down 1/2 strip every few days. Today, I just went down to 1/2 twice per day. Fortunately I didn't always take the 2 1/2 per day, so I have now 13 full strips and 8 of the 5.7 mg/1.4 mg (Zubsolv sublingual tablets) left. I definatly feel the effects of the cut-down as I am easily irritated, stressed and a nervous wreck. I have to get off of this medication. Could you please advise a plan for me with the amount I have left?
    Thanks,
    Rusty

  5. #335
    LionHeart333 is offline New Member
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    Default 3years Suboxone only

    Quote Originally Posted by Magdalena12 View Post
    Dear Vicissitude-

    I feel I have to add something to you post regarding "suboxone taper should only be monitored by a certified doctor". The FACT is, even doctors "certified" in suboxone therapy OFTEN DO NOT taper or perform induction of suboxone properly. Many people have come to this site scared to death of suboxone because they have tried using it to "taper" per their physicians instructions and have had terrible withdrawal, precipitated withdrawal, etc. I think you are extremely lucky if you happen upon an addiction physician that has taken the time and effort to follow his patient's closely to perform a proper unduction and adjust the taper dosages according to their symtpoms. Plus, most doctors, mine included, tend to think that patients need to be on suboxone for a year or more before even attempting to taper. It is my understanding, from monitoring this site and reading many posts that the longer you are on suboxone, the harder it is to get off of, just like any addictive drug. Many people have come to this forum desperate, myself included. There are people (Robert, Melinda, Musicman, etc) who are very dedicated and have had a lot of experience helping people taper off suboxone and I can tell you the taper schedule is VERY different than what most doctors would have you do. There have been many success stories here, people who were about to give up on the process of getting clean because the "doctor's taper" was just wrong. The people that monitor this site have been in our shoes and they know what works. I'll give you an example of what my "certified subxone physician" told me. My first visit after being inducted on suboxone (I followed the induction protocol from THIS site, not my doctors), I was feeling very clear-head and very hopeful for the first time in YEARS. He proceeded to tell me that he doubted I could ever get off opiates (I had been on methadone for 2 years and norco for 5 years) and that it was likely I would be on suboxone for a long time, even my lifetime. I was devasted, but fortunately I have the support of the people in this little community and I chose to listen to them as they are living proof that it CAN be done, if done properly. Everyone reacts differently to drugs or medications and I feel it is VITAL to be monitored closely, which is what they do here, so that the APPROPRIATE changes can be made to your dose when necessary. There is a gentleman here named Robert that has literally sat up all night helping people get inducted onto suboxone properly and helped people taper off successfully! Successful induction takes close monitoring to know when it is safe to take your first dose, but most physicians just give the patient a set amount of hours since their last dose of opiates to start the suboxone, OFTEN this leads to precipitated withdrawal.

    I am an R.N. and usually I would agree with you about medications being "monitored by a certified doctor", but in the case of suboxone I think many physicians just aren't interested in this "type" of medicine to take the time that is required to monitor their patient's appropriately.

    mags
    Suboxone is a wonderful drug...... I was on heavy oxy, roxy, for about 2.5 years and withdrawal symptoms were excruciating...... I started on 3-8mg sub films daily down to 2 1/4 pieces daily/(morn) (eve), "currently" of course after tapering down over time, and let me tell y'all I have messed up and took to many subs out of my script in the past and went about 2 weeks without anything and never felt no where near as bad as coming off oxy,... Ect... I did feel tired and a little clamy but nothing unbearable like coming off of nasty ass pills.... (roxy, oxy, Ect...) ever since I've taken suboxone I've had no urge for pills.... If u want to get clean and do it right listen to your doctor.. You cannot have the mentality that your gonna take a few subs then see how many days you can go to get high that's ridiculous and you wonder why your still feeling withdrawals badly? My point is you do rite you want to get clean you will get clean...

  6. #336
    LionHeart333 is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vicissitude View Post
    Forgetting about your atrocious spelling and grammar for a moment, your information is completely false. Tapering should ONLY, and let me repeat ONLY be monitored by a certified doctor, whether it be an opioid or an agonist like Suboxone or Subutex.

    If done correctly, coming off of Suboxone is so much easier than coming off opioids. I did it quite easily with the help of my doctor. Spewing out what you experienced doesn't make it right. You definitely did not use the proper medical protocol to try (and that would go for all of you who have posted about Suboxone withdrawal).
    Suboxone is a wonderful drug...... I was on heavy oxy, roxy, for about 2.5 years and withdrawal symptoms were excruciating...... I started on 3-8mg sub films daily down to 2 1/4 pieces daily/(morn) (eve), "currently" of course after tapering down over time, and let me tell y'all I have messed up and took to many subs out of my script in the past and went about 2 weeks without anything and never felt no where near as bad as coming off oxy,... Ect... I did feel tired and a little clamy but nothing unbearable like coming off of nasty ass pills.... (roxy, oxy, Ect...) ever since I've taken suboxone I've had no urge for pills.... If u want to get clean and do it right listen to your doctor.. You cannot have the mentality that your gonna take a few subs then see how many days you can go to get high that's ridiculous and you wonder why your still feeling withdrawals badly? My point is you do rite you want to get clean you will get clean...

  7. #337
    dmitrysm is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by guts5460 View Post
    Hi all,
    I have been on suboxone for 2 1/2 years now for treatment of pain killer addiction. Unfortunately I lost my job last month along with my insurance. I am trying to wean myself off of this expensive treatment. This site seems very helpful yet confusing, because of the difference of dosages. I am prescribed to 2 and 1/2 of the 8 mg/2 mg films per day. I've been cutting down 1/2 strip every few days. Today, I just went down to 1/2 twice per day. Fortunately I didn't always take the 2 1/2 per day, so I have now 13 full strips and 8 of the 5.7 mg/1.4 mg (Zubsolv sublingual tablets) left. I definatly feel the effects of the cut-down as I am easily irritated, stressed and a nervous wreck. I have to get off of this medication. Could you please advise a plan for me with the amount I have left?
    Thanks,
    Rusty
    The only helpful thing I can tell you is suboxone's bioavailability has a ceiling, making it impossible to of once a user has a tolerance to it. This is why patients are never prescribed more than 24mg. In effect, 8mg covers, let's say, 87% of your opiate receptors; 16mg covers 95%; and 24mg covers pretty much 99-100%. So this means if you started out taking 20mg daily, jump to 8 mg right away. In my experience, the wd is worse at lower dosages. I was stuck at 1mg per day and never could go past that amount on my own. But yeah, if you want something of a soft landing stretch the taper at the lower end of the dose, otherwise you'll go through your entire stash in a matter of days.

    Good luck!

  8. #338
    dmitrysm is offline New Member
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    Oops now I saw your post is from Oct. 2014. Well I hope you succeeded one way or another.

  9. #339
    Imdoingthis is offline New Member
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    I am 78 hrs suboxone free. So far no cravings like the last 2 times I've tried to quit taking them. Symptoms aren't that bad. Didn't sleep well last night. Trying to stay active to help out. Every time I get sick to my stomach I try to move around to help out and it works so far. I am taking a multi vitamin, l-lysine, & b12 extended release, celexa, BC powder, and phenergan (oh and something I've always done when sick. Put an onion on the bottom of your feet to get rod of toxins) . Plus I have made up my mind I can do this and will do this. For those wanting to know I didn't titrate down. I stopped at 1 8/2 a day. I have much determination in this and no this to shall pass. Suboxone had become a major crutch in my life. I was on it for 5 1/2 years. I wish I would have done this a long time ago but I can't dwell in the past. Just know it can be done. I know this storm is not over but I do know that this 2 shall pass and God will get me through this.

  10. #340
    Brandylee is offline New Member
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    I'm Sorry bpchep could you please tell me your formula again and maybe alittle simpler I want to try it I have almost 120 and this is my one chance

  11. #341
    Brandylee is offline New Member
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    Not to mention you could have a dr like I did who drops you or simply does not care and now you are left to taper down yourself, we are their paycheck ultimately and they don't really care if your an addict or not

  12. #342
    Kanadaguy is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vicissitude View Post
    Forgetting about your atrocious spelling and grammar for a moment, your information is completely false. Tapering should ONLY, and let me repeat ONLY be monitored by a certified doctor, whether it be an opioid or an agonist like Suboxone or Subutex.

    If done correctly, coming off of Suboxone is so much easier than coming off opioids. I did it quite easily with the help of my doctor. Spewing out what you experienced doesn't make it right. You definitely did not use the proper medical protocol to try (and that would go for all of you who have posted about Suboxone withdrawal).
    Ok attacking him because of his spelling and grammar is not needed. In fact your whole post reminds me of someone who makes money selling these meds to people who are addicted to it.

    Remember your dealing with people who are addicted to this stuff. Not because they want to be, but rather because of poor decisions and such. The key here is they are people too, someone's child, someone's parent, someone's sibling. The point is not only are they suffering but everyone around them is heart broken unable to really help.

    I will tell you my story and my take on this... I used to take 8 perkocets and was suggested to take methadone. In total I spent 9 years taking all these meds. Throughout those 9 years I was never asked if I wanted to lower my dose but rather when I did lower it and explained I was feeling >>>>>> (your going to have to feel >>>>>> to get off) they would always suggest I STOP going down or even take more. I was going to a clinic that is part of the OATC in Ontario Canada which is a group of clinics that do methadone and suboxone. I always stayed below 25mg and tapered myself off. When your higher you can go down 4mg but when you get lower you need to start lowering by 1mg. When you get really low you get worried the pharmacy will mix up your dose and give you a large dose which would be dangerous. That was something that I always worried about the speed at which they dispensed this >>>>. Also if you goto the pharmacy that is partnered or owned by the clinic it always seems like the dosages where never consistent. I often wondered if this was a ploy to get people to increase thier dose..... So closer to the end at like 10 I started to feel better and started to swim everyday and I think this is key to coming off this >>>>. I think working out releases endorphins and you get hooked on those because your body is losing the opiates and in withdrawal then pumped up with endorphins from working out. I got off methadone and I don't know many who did and I haven't looked back and ended up starting a very successful business. When I came off this suboxone was new and from what I learned speaking to doctors who prescribe it is its stronger and stays in your system for longer then methadone and that >>>> took a good 6 months before I felt normal maybe even a year fully. That >>>> just gets into your bones so if suboxone is stronger then it WILL be harder to come off in my opinion. No I don't have first hand experience however the experience I do have would suggest this. I suspect all this super sub pro guys and gals are people who make money from it. Methadone should not be taken unless you plan to be on it for the rest of your life and should only be given to people in those situations. My opinion is the same with suboxone. The doctors where snakes in the grass and wanted you on this >>>> and made no freaking effort to help you come off if anything they make it harder.

    Try to taper off the opiates your on if you can't and must take methadone or suboxone I think it needs to be taken for a very short taper like a month or two maybe 3 no more and you need to be tapering and yeah not gonna feel the best but the ONLY way to get off this >>>> and to say in your head I'm gonna do this come haven or hell and I'm tough as nails. You gotta have it in you for the fight and it really is a fight for your life. You also must use exercise but hard sweating exercise, swimming is fantastic ... You will find you get hooked on that and it actually helps with bone pain and other symptoms ... Also look into the thrive diet it's a vegan diet and can help you get off it helped me it helps clean this >>>> out of your system. DONT GIVE UP AND GET OFF THIS >>>> FOR YOURSELF LIFE IS SO MUCH BETTER OFF IT. I shared my experience in hopes it will help someone who wants off all this >>>>.

    Good luck

  13. #343
    Mcwilliamsj73 is offline New Member
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    Hi Robert,

    I have been on subutex for over 10 years. At the Highest I was taking 16-24 mg a day. I have been tapering off for the last year rather comfortably and am now taking 1 mg a day which I started around 6 days ago. The problem is my sleeping. I am having vivid drug using nightmares and wake up from one every 2 hours. I haven’t experienced anything like this in my prior taper time. Any suggestions?

  14. #344
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    Hello McWilliams welcome to the forum. Wow that sure was a lot of subs. Congratulations on tapering down so low. You should start a thread here for yourself so others will be able to follow you. Again welcome and congratulations.
    We are all here to support you.

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