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Suboxone and surgery Please Help!!
  1. #1
    kathy8167 is offline Junior Member
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    Question Suboxone and surgery Please Help!!

    Please help, please reply!

    I have been on suboxone for 9 months. I need to have knee surgery. I talked to my dr. about how suboxone will affect my surgery since the surgeon didn't even know what it was. The surgeon wanted to give me pain meds during and after the surgery. My dr (who prescribes the suboxone) thinks I can go through surgery and after without any narcotic. I should just continue on suboxone as planned. I am so scared of this. I have had this knee surgery before and it is excruciating even with narcotics. How am I going to cope with Celebrex and Tylenol? I am thinking of not even getting my knee fixed but then I would deal with continuing pain and not being able to work. So, I need to have the surgery. I can deal with the pain a day after the surgery without narcotics, but I cannot imagine acute surgical pain without any narcotics. I want to quit the suboxone before I have surgery and then go back on them after my pain is manageable. Does anyone know if that is a good idea? How long do I have to be off of four 8mg. suboxones before I can take a narcotic? Does anybody have any other ideas? Any response is greatly appreciated. Thank you.

  2. #2
    Robert_325 is offline Diamond Elite
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    Coming from someone who has had five knee surgeries and several others I can't imagine doing a knee surgery with no pain meds at all. I'm not a dr but that sounds crazy to me. What kind of surgery are you having? Even a scope leaves us in bad pain afterwards. I am not saying you couldn't survive it without meds, but why would you do that? Yes you can get off the suboxone for a few days and then take meds. You may have some w/ds with no suboxone after taking it as long as you have. I would question the dr about this. I don't understand why he would want you to do the surgery with no meds.

    I just looked back at your post. Do I understand correctly that you are at 32mg of suboxone a day right now??? If so that is why your dr doesn't want you to stop. Why are you taking that much suboxone???
    Last edited by Anonymous; 07-05-2008 at 12:57 AM.

  3. #3
    movado2008 is offline New Member
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    The Dr who prescribes the Suboxone has two concerns. One is that you end up back on pain medications and not attend to your addiction to opiates. The other is that he will or could loose a potential patient that he prescribes suboxone to. if you have a good support sytem in place you probably could use the pain meds and return to suboxone once the pain is manageable but you might be better off having someone you trust to hold the pain meds for you and only give them to you as prescribed. again having a support system in place will make a difference. I am no DR eighther and that is just my opinion.

  4. #4
    kathy8167 is offline Junior Member
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    Default To Robert 325 and others

    Thank you so much for your response. I GREATLY appreciate it. I feel so alone in this suboxone world. I don't know why I am on 32 mg. of suboxone. I'm an addict and was addicted to all opiates for ten+ years. I have attempted suicide and almost, I mean literally almost died 4 times while going through withdrawal. My doctor feels suboxone will probably be lifelong. I don't think so as I want to have another baby in a few years. I started out on 8 mg. of suboxone. I told my doctor I still had cravings. Not withdrawals, just cravings. I think I will always have cravings once in a while. Don't we all? Every time I said that, he just upped my dose. I am now at the maximum amount he can prescribe. I jus though it was a normal dose, but now I see it's a lot! I want to go through surgery with pain meds. I have had this surgery before and it is PAINFUL! Now it is even more invasive as they need to actually make an incision instead of a scope to cut away bone and insert something else. (don't know what that something is.) I am going to talk to him about going off the suboxone for as many days as I need to so I can experience pain relief. I fully intend to go back on my suboxone in a couple days to a week. I don't have a dealer (never have) all my drugs were doctor prescibed. I knew how to manipulate doctors and ER docs, but now I am flagged EVERYWHERE! I want to go back on the suboxone because I have made change in my life and I am happy. If I used drugs again, I would lose everything! But also, I don't know where I would get drugs to continue my supply. I have no connections to getting more opiates. I don't want those connections. I want to wean down slowly to a more appropriate dose. I don't feel high, doped up, or even tired with my current dose, I'm used to it. I remember I used to get so drowsy that I would fall asleep at my dining room table while I was smoking. I have tons of burn holes in my carpet. But now I am used to my dose. Robert, are you also on suboxone? What dose are you on? What is your drug history? Do you know how long I would have to be without suboxone for my pain meds to work? I have read that doctors say a few days but their are horror stories of people who have their surgeries and the pain meds are still not working at that time. I know my doctor is scared I will attempt suicide with any kind of withdrawal but I think I will be okay knowing that it will not be forever and it's worth it to avoid that awful pain. Please respond Robert. I have nobody to talk to about suboxone. I really need some support. Please!!!!!!!!! Also, if anybody can add anything about this, please do!! Please respond, I need some help! Every response is valuable. I appreciate them all. Thank you everybody for your time in reading this. God Bless.

  5. #5
    kathy8167 is offline Junior Member
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    To movado2008:

    Thank you so much for you reply. I have already talked to my boyfriend and he will hold my pain meds so I can avoid temptation to take more than is prescribed. I know I will want more. I just know it. I will be craving more, I will even probably ask for more. There is no way my boyfriend will give me any more that is prescribed, even if I threaten him. I have told him that I may beg, manipulate, even threaten him for more meds. He agreed to not give me any more. I told him I will not be in my right mind when I am taking opiates but I need them to avoid acute surgical pain. He knows when I am back on my suboxone, I will thank him for helping me stay on track. My boyfriend fully supports my recovery. I do not want to take more than prescribed, I really want to do this right. I just know that once I star taking them, I will crave more. I do know however, that going back on my suboxone will help immensely. It will make it easier to stop taking the opiates. Even if I try to get more from my doctor, he will only give me a limitied supply. I'm nervous, but I think that's good. It tells me I'm cautious and do not want to give up my sober life. Movado, are you on suboxone? What is your drug history? Please respond. If anybody else has anything to add, please respond. I feel alone in this suboxone world. I attend church-related recovery groups but nobody there is going through what I am. If anybody can relate, or know how long I will have to be off suboxone so that my pain meds will work, please let me know. Any response is appreciated! Thank you for your time in reading this.

  6. #6
    Robert_325 is offline Diamond Elite
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    Default Kathy

    I detoxed my last and I hope the final time with subutex ... basically same as suboxone. So you know, to answer your questions I used opiates for almost 40 years. Bad the last 15 years ... plus benzos, somas, etc. I quit using recreational drugs many years ago but did ridiculous amounts of everything for probably 25 years from around 1968 up until about 1993. Prior to going on subutex I was taking 40 lorcets a day, plus tons of benzos and somas. Prior to that I was taking 30 30mg Roxicodone a day. So when drs say you have to take 32mg of suboxone and I managed fine on 8mg I say bull dookey. I don't think that I am that exceptional that all the drugs didn't bother me just like they would anyone. Why do people get prescribed so much suboxone when I KNOW it doesn't take that much? You should start tapering down now. That is only my opinion, but I believe it strongly.

    I totally believe you would be fine in surgery after a few days off suboxone, but I would make sure if it was me. We are all a little different. I would probably lay off the suboxone for three days and take a medicinal dose of a percocet or something comparable and see if it works or not. I would only do it once to make sure. Then I would know prior to hitting the table. Just tell your dr what and why you are doing this. It should be ok. Remember that if you go three days without the suboxone you will going into w/ds from it by then. Just plan on that. Take the suboxone again about 16-18 hours after you take the ONE dose of opiate and the w/ds will be over. I think it would be worth the w/d symptoms to know for sure the pain meds will work during surgery.

    If you have read many of my posts you will know I spend a lot of time replying to people using or trying to stop using suboxone. I am here most every day. Just post how things are going and I will see your posts when I log on. I can also give you some suggestions on dropping the dose of suboxone as soon as you are ready.

  7. #7
    kathy8167 is offline Junior Member
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    Default Robert:

    Thank you so much for the reply. I find it very encouraging that you have been able to quit using with only 8mg of suboxone after the 40 years of strong opiate abuse. I do want to start tapering down immediately. I'm scared. I want to do this right. I want to do it slow cuz if I try to do it fast, I am afraid I will relapse. I have never been strong enough to handle withdrawal it is so horrible that I would rather die than experience it. I don't want to feel the least bit uncomfortable. Okay, here's the total honest truth... I am abusing the suboxone. I never thought I could do this but I am. I run out of my pills early and I seem to be able to refill early. I always find a way to refill a week early. I don't want to do this anymore! I eventually want to be off this med... I want to have a baby in a year or two. I am used to taking 4 pills one day then 5 or 6 the next. It depends on how I feel. I don't think I am experiencing physical withdrawal symptoms but I am prone to depression and I think it will make me feel better. I tried going with only two pills a day but that was impossible. What do you think if I stick with only 4 pills a day like I'm supposed to for two weeks. Then start the taper? Should I go down to 3 and a half o just 3, or what, and how long? I see my doctor on Friday to talk about the upcoming knee surgery (I have not scheduled it yet.) I am going to express how I do not want to go through surgery and the first days after without narcotic pain meds and see what he says. I hope it goes well. Thanks again for getting back to me. I assume you were only on suboxone for a limited time just to get through w/d's right? I wish I had done that. Anyway, what do you think about the taper. Any advice? Keep in mind I have been taking it for a long time. I posted before that I have been taking suboxone for 9 months. Actually, it has been 1 yr. and 5 months. I couldn't remember when I started taking suboxone and just guessed a figure. But then I really thought about it and couldn't believe that it really has been that long. Have a good day!

  8. #8
    kathy8167 is offline Junior Member
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    Default Robert:

    Thank you so much for the reply. I find it very encouraging that you have been able to quit using with only 8mg of suboxone after the 40 years of strong opiate abuse. I do want to start tapering down immediately. I'm scared. I want to do this right. I want to do it slow cuz if I try to do it fast, I am afraid I will relapse. I have never been strong enough to handle withdrawal it is so horrible that I would rather die than experience it. I don't want to feel the least bit uncomfortable. Okay, here's the total honest truth... I am abusing the suboxone. I never thought I could do this but I am. I run out of my pills early and I seem to be able to refill early. I always find a way to refill a week early. I don't want to do this anymore! I eventually want to be off this med... I want to have a baby in a year or two. I am used to taking 4 pills one day then 5 or 6 the next. It depends on how I feel. I don't think I am experiencing physical withdrawal symptoms but I am prone to depression and I think it will make me feel better. I tried going with only two pills a day but that was impossible. What do you think if I stick with only 4 pills a day like I'm supposed to for two weeks. Then start the taper? Should I go down to 3 and a half o just 3, or what, and how long? I see my doctor on Friday to talk about the upcoming knee surgery (I have not scheduled it yet.) I am going to express how I do not want to go through surgery and the first days after without narcotic pain meds and see what he says. I hope it goes well. Thanks again for getting back to me. I assume you were only on suboxone for a limited time just to get through w/d's right? I wish I had done that. Anyway, what do you think about the taper. Any advice? Keep in mind I have been taking it for a long time. I posted before that I have been taking suboxone for 9 months. Actually, it has been 1 yr. and 5 months. I couldn't remember when I started taking suboxone and just guessed a figure. But then I really thought about it and couldn't believe that it really has been that long. Have a good day!

  9. #9
    Robert_325 is offline Diamond Elite
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    Default Kathy

    I am glad you used the correct numbers on time and amount of pills you are taking. We need those accurate numbers to give good advice. Don't abuse suboxone! Makes no sense and it just screws this all up trying to stop. So in reality you are taking 40mg plus some days. That is ridiculous. You don't do that with this medication. It's not like popping a few extra lorcets or percs. You don't take that much suboxone. Yes I would take the four pills for about a week like you are prescribed and don't take more than that no matter what. Then reduce to 12mg for about a week, then to 8mg for about a week. Make it through that and then I will help you with a good taper plan if you want me to. After being on suboxone as long as you have been on it and taking crazy amounts of it like you have taken this needs to be a slow process if you don't want to have suboxone w/ds. I'm not going anywhere and I'm on here most every day. And yes I only used sub for about six weeks total including my taper off them.

  10. #10
    kathy8167 is offline Junior Member
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    Default Robert:

    Thanks so much for your willingness to help me and all of us! I have seen you post a lot of responses to help us with this crazy addiction!! No, I shouldn't abuse suboxone. I went on it, not to get off, but to replace the opiates. I thought in my addicted mind: "Cool! I can get drugs legally to replace my opiates that were so hard to get and insurance will even cover it!" I knew I wouldn't be high every day, but I also knew that I would be very comfortable because even AFTER withdrawal, adjusting to sober life is difficult. I have changed my thinking now. I don't want these stupid pills anymore. I don' want to run out and wonder what am I going to do now? I want to be honest in my recovery group. I want to be proud of myself. I don't want to feel "dopey" anymoe. I take extra suboxone to help me sleep. Depression makes me want to sleep for escape. That will be the hardest: the insomnia that comes with withdrawal. Some people get sleepy, but I get restless legs syndrome and climb the walls when I try to sleep! Anyway, I am only taking 32 mg the last two days. (only. sounds stupid huh?) I will for 5 more days but do you think that going down to 12 mg is okay? I am scared, very scared. 4 pills to 1 1/2 pills? If you think I should, then I'll try it.
    cindy myers likes this.

  11. #11
    Robert_325 is offline Diamond Elite
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    Quote Originally Posted by kathy8167 View Post
    Thanks so much for your willingness to help me and all of us! I have seen you post a lot of responses to help us with this crazy addiction!! No, I shouldn't abuse suboxone. I went on it, not to get off, but to replace the opiates. I thought in my addicted mind: "Cool! I can get drugs legally to replace my opiates that were so hard to get and insurance will even cover it!" I knew I wouldn't be high every day, but I also knew that I would be very comfortable because even AFTER withdrawal, adjusting to sober life is difficult. I have changed my thinking now. I don't want these stupid pills anymore. I don' want to run out and wonder what am I going to do now? I want to be honest in my recovery group. I want to be proud of myself. I don't want to feel "dopey" anymoe. I take extra suboxone to help me sleep. Depression makes me want to sleep for escape. That will be the hardest: the insomnia that comes with withdrawal. Some people get sleepy, but I get restless legs syndrome and climb the walls when I try to sleep! Anyway, I am only taking 32 mg the last two days. (only. sounds stupid huh?) I will for 5 more days but do you think that going down to 12 mg is okay? I am scared, very scared. 4 pills to 1 1/2 pills? If you think I should, then I'll try it.


    Going from 4 pills to 1 1/2 pills (12mg) is not that big of a deal. 12mg is still kind of a high dose. You have just been taking huge amounts. To me 12mg would have been a high dose. I am not only suggesting dropping to 12mg ... I am suggesting going to zero mg. After 12mg I can then help you with a normal taper, but first your dose has got to be taken down. You have developed a mind set that you need this high dose when in reality you do not. Trust me on this. You don't need anywhere near as much of this med as you are taking. When I began to taper it amazed me how easy it was. We just have to do a good slow taper and there won't be any major problems. This is going to take a while to do with no major w/ds. Just relax and do it. Good luck.

  12. #12
    kathy8167 is offline Junior Member
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    Default Robert:

    I am still taking the 32mg. of suboxone a day. I will in 4 days go down to 12mg. I know my mind set is that I need this much so I'm going to trust what you say and just take the 12mg. for a week and then 8mg. the next. Wish me good luck and I'll keep you updated. I seen my doctor today about the knee surgery and pain meds. He is okay with me being off the suboxone for three days and then I can stay over night to make sure my pain is adequately attended to. He said that I might have to take a lot to get pain relief because my body is already opiate tolerant at such a high dose. Being in the hospital is good because I can start at a normal dose and go higher if need be. Then when the pain is manageable probably after 3 days to a week I can stop taking the pain meds, go into mild withdrawal and go back on the suboxone. I asked him about tapering and he said I should take 3 1/2 pills for a month and down 1/2 pill (4mg) every month thereafter. I think that is rediculous. I will try it your way. I also want to be down to a low dose by the time I have surgery. Then I know the pain meds will work and I won't have to take so much narcotics. Some doctor's like to keep you hooked and some doctors don't want to give you anything even when you are in legitimate, excruciating pain!!! Weird huh? where are the sensible happy medium docs? Bye for now, I'll let you know how going down to 12 mg. goes.

  13. #13
    Robert_325 is offline Diamond Elite
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    Being confined overnight is a great idea. I started to suggest that but so often they don't want to keep us overnight. Didn't know how they would react. That is good news.

    I think a taper is a good idea, the only way to do this, but dropping at the rate your dr suggested seems awfully slow to me. I think you will do fine being a little more aggressive as we have discussed. Remember you can always take another little piece if you go into w/ds and you will be better almost immediately. Why not push ourself a little with that kind of a safety net? You will do fine. If you were to taper the way he is suggesting you would be on the suboxone for almost another year tapering! That is nuts.

  14. #14
    countrymama08 is offline New Member
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    Default Fyi

    just to let u know I am also on suboxone...I had surgery....I stopped my sub like a week before surgery...my back dr. had given me some 20 mg oxicton....they never worked for me...before surgery or after...I did have alot of pain after surgery.....I was on 20 mg oxycotin and 10 mg oxycodone...they never touched my pain...8 days after surgery I had enough and went back on my suboxone...they worked very well for my pain..Pain Pills Dont Work For Me Anymore....I've been on 8mg sub for 2 years..I take one in the mornin..one afternoon....Good Luck..

  15. #15
    kathy8167 is offline Junior Member
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    Default Update:

    OK. Yesterday I went down to 12mg. I felt fine yesterday. I felt fine this morning. I am now at 1pm experiencing some minor withdrawal. I hate this. It's minor, but I know what bad withdrawals are and feeling a little of it makes me so SCARED! I will stick with this though. I know I can do it. I NEED to do it. I want to be down to as low of a dose before I have to stop altogether 3 days before the surgery. I asked my doctor if he could prescribe me a percocet just to see if it works after the 36 hours of my last suboxone dose. He said he can't because he can only prescribe suboxone for opiate maintenance. All other opiates he can only prescribe for pain. He can't even give me one percocet to try out because I'm not "in pain." Then he said to go three days from my last dose of suboxone and he was sure that would be long enough. UGH! I understand his point, he's not going to risk his MD license over this! I respect that but your idea Robert was a very good one. I have no way of getting a perc or anything for that matter. I have no connections and I am certainly not going to look for any at this point. The only thing I could do is fake pain at a local hospital not affiliated with my doctor. I just can't do that because it's lying, and it's wrong! And what if my doctor found out about it? He prescribes suboxone under the assumption that I am working on recovery. Working on recovery does not include faking pain to get narcotics from an ER. So, I will go three days without suboxone. I will do okay right? I won't take any because I know it won't last forever and I know I need to do this to avoid the awful pain of knee surgery. Thanks for listening (or reading I should say. )

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    sexiduck is offline New Member
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    Default wow

    I just wanted to say how impressed with the support here, I could really use some of it!

    good luck Kathy w/ your taper...I've just been reading and decided to send some luck everyone's way especially yours, I can't imagine any kind of surgery without pain medication! I hope it works out great, from your attitude it seems like you will do great

  17. #17
    kathy8167 is offline Junior Member
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    Default To Robert325:

    Hi. I just wanted some advice. I am still on the 12mg. of suboxone for the last 10 days. I went from the 32mg a day down to 12 so I am proud of myself. I know I should be weaning down again but I do not want to do such a big jump this time. That really sucked. I still get the sweats, goosebumps, extreme anxiety, and immense cravings! I'm holding on because I know I do not want so much suboxone in me when I have to quit three days prior to surgery. I need take my last suboxone on Aug. 3 to be sure I can feel relief from my pain meds. Do you think I should start weaning so that by Aug. 3, I am down to nothing? Or just wean slowly and stop whatever dose I'm at on Aug. 3? After surgery, I am going back on suboxone and wean off like you did. You said it took you 5 o 6 weeks? I want to do it slowly as I do hate withdrawal. That's why we take it right? Maybe you could suggest how much I should take when I go back on the suboxone? I don't trust my doctor as he thinks I should be on the maximum dose forever. Thank you in advance for your response. You are doing the Lord's work by posting and helping everyone. I also am encouraged to see how you tell people that your life has changed due to Jesus Christ. I am a Christian but while being on so much suboxone, I haven't turned to Him as often as I should. My guilt of knowing that I was abusing suboxone kept me away. I am praying more and going to church again. Thanks so much.
    Kathy

  18. #18
    bev49 is offline Banned
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    Kathy, I wish you nothing but the best. First of all, listen to Robert. He is the most knowledgeable one here in my opinion. I am just like you, terrified of withdrawal. I think some people have a lower threshold for pain and discomfort. I have 0. I have been on opiates for 40 years. I shot >>>>>> for 10 years back in the 60's and 70's then got on a methadone maintenance program and was on meth for more than 30 years if you can believe that! Anyway, I tapered my meth to 20 mgs. for the last few years and didn't think sub could work because of my LONG time addiction problems. I started suboxone 5 days ago. I stabilized on 16 mgs., 8 2x a day. I am totally fine, no withdrawal whatsoever. My doctor says I will be on sub a long time because of my long history, but following Robert in the threads, I am believing it might not be necessary. I am dropping to 12 mgs. next week, then I will try 8 mgs. and stay there for a good while. I do not want to be tied to a meth clinic or any opiate addiction for that matter. This drug works but is really not meant to be abused. I don't think it really works. You don't get high so whats the point of taking alot of it? Less is more as far as suboxone goes, I believe. I would be terrified of surgery without pain meds. I have had 3 major surgeries so I know. Get off the sub for 3 days like you were advised. It won't be fun but at least the pain meds will work for you. Get back on sub after surgery but no more high doses. There is no point. And listen to Robert. He knows what he is talking about. Best of luck and best wishes.
    Bev

  19. #19
    Robert_325 is offline Diamond Elite
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    Quote Originally Posted by kathy8167 View Post
    Hi. I just wanted some advice. I am still on the 12mg. of suboxone for the last 10 days. I went from the 32mg a day down to 12 so I am proud of myself. I know I should be weaning down again but I do not want to do such a big jump this time. That really sucked. I still get the sweats, goosebumps, extreme anxiety, and immense cravings! I'm holding on because I know I do not want so much suboxone in me when I have to quit three days prior to surgery. I need take my last suboxone on Aug. 3 to be sure I can feel relief from my pain meds. Do you think I should start weaning so that by Aug. 3, I am down to nothing? Or just wean slowly and stop whatever dose I'm at on Aug. 3? After surgery, I am going back on suboxone and wean off like you did. You said it took you 5 o 6 weeks? I want to do it slowly as I do hate withdrawal. That's why we take it right? Maybe you could suggest how much I should take when I go back on the suboxone? I don't trust my doctor as he thinks I should be on the maximum dose forever. Thank you in advance for your response. You are doing the Lord's work by posting and helping everyone. I also am encouraged to see how you tell people that your life has changed due to Jesus Christ. I am a Christian but while being on so much suboxone, I haven't turned to Him as often as I should. My guilt of knowing that I was abusing suboxone kept me away. I am praying more and going to church again. Thanks so much.
    Kathy



    Hi Kathy,

    I respect you for holding out and not taking more. If you didn't have the surgery coming up so soon I would definitely tell you to take a little more now. We aren't supposed to have w/d symptoms while on suboxone. That is why we take it to begin with. But you really need to lower your dose or the pain meds they give might not work. It makes sense that if you are on say 6mg or preferably less at surgery time that pain meds would work better faster than if you were still at 32mg. You have really done well dropping so quickly. I was hoping you would do like you have.

    I don't think you have to be titrated down to 0mg by surgery date. That would be ideal but I question whether it's really conceivable without just doing a cold turkey. If you get the dose down significantly like to 6mg or less then you will probably be okay after a good three days without. Not 36 hours but three days or more. If you got the dose down to zero there would be no reason to even take anymore again. You will have w/d even at 4mg going that 3-4 days with no suboxone. It will suck into the second day or the third day for sure. No way to get around it. The longer you go without suboxone before surgery though the better the meds will likely work for you. I still wish the dr would give you a Perc or something to try before surgery. He could do it if he wanted to I promise. This would be a legitimate reason to prescribe it. He is just being a jerk I think.

    As far as what to take after surgery I would say to wait and see what you are at going into surgery and how it all goes. You will probably be geeking good by the time surgery is over. You will have been without suboxone or opiates for a while. You will need to stabilize again and relax a couple days following surgery. So we can see then what is the best dose to start back at.

    I am happy to hear you are a Christian. Anything about me that is good is Jesus Christ working through me. He healed me from three serious autoimmune diseases, degenerative disc disease, 2 blood clots, 7 orthopedic surgeries, addiction ... the list goes on. I mean I now have a totally normal CBC, RF, ESR, ANA ... I know you said you are a nurse. Well all the blood tests that have always been off the charts don't show anything anymore. That is pretty wild. I say it's a miracle. Even had a spot on my abdomen from an ultrasound disappear. It's gone. I was on 14 prescriptions two years ago and today I take two. That is why while I mention it in posts, I don't push it at all, but if I am ever asked I will give my testimony in a heart beat.

    Don't be so hard on yourself. Christ knows your heart. You don't have to hide from Him or be ashamed because of suboxone. All He wants is to talk with you. He will help you through this. Ask and you shall receive. That is pretty simple. God bless.

  20. #20
    elusivechris is offline New Member
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    Default Kathy listen !

    Suboxone IS A PAIN KILLER ! you just dont get High from it, trust me just take your 32 ml a day and youll be FINE ! I have been told by countless Dr's who know ALOT about Suboxone ! also I am in a Outpatient program and they say the same thing, I had a tooth pulled and I was worried about the same thing, but i was fine, I take 24 mls a day. Am I the ONLY person on this board that knows this?
    Last edited by Anonymous; 07-29-2008 at 03:58 AM.

  21. #21
    kathy8167 is offline Junior Member
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    Default To: Elusivechris

    Quote Originally Posted by elusivechris View Post
    Suboxone IS A PAIN KILLER ! you just dont get High from it, trust me just take your 32 ml a day and youll be FINE ! I have been told by countless Dr's who know ALOT about Suboxone ! also I am in a Outpatient program and they say the same thing, I had a tooth pulled and I was worried about the same thing, but i was fine, I take 24 mls a day. Am I the ONLY person on this board that knows this?
    You can not be more WRONG elusivechris!! Trust me, I know from EXPERIENCE! Yes, I admit, suboxone has buprenorphine which is a partial agonist opiate. One does not feel the effects (euphoria, pain relief) as much as with a full opiate agonist, like morphine or Vicodin. Doctor's will say bup is ten times stronger than morphine, but that only means that it binds tighter to the opiate receptors than the full agonists. That in no way means that it gives ten times the pain relief. It just means that if I take morphine while on suboxone, the morphine is not strong enough to kick the bup off the opiate receptors and it would be useless. Taking the 32mg. of suboxone will not give me adequate pain relief as my body is used to it. I just recently weaned down to 12mg. two weeks ago. Also, bup is not intended for acute pain, especially acute surgical pain. I understand you had tooth extractions while on suboxone and it worked great. I had three teeth pulled fully awake with just novocaine while on suboxone. It hurt mildly because it's only supposed to hurt mildly. I did, however, have 3 sudden kidney stones that were extremely painful while on suboxone. I could not receive pain meds as I had taken my suboxone already that day so it would do no good. I passed the stone within 8 hours. The pain was almost unbearable at times. My point with that is: My suboxone didn't help with the acute pain of kidney stones and it is not going to help with the acute pain of upcoming knee surgery. It is similar to a person on methadone maintenance. The 80mg. of methadone (or whatever) would be adequate pain control for an opiate naive person or it could even cause respiratory distress at such a high dose. But for the person on methadone, that 80mg. will not provide any analgesia as his body is tolerant of this dose, and will require more opiates for pain control. Many doctors have shared your opinion, elusivechris, and their patients have had to endure painful procedures, surgeries, you name it, because their doctor believed these myths.
    Last edited by Anonymous; 07-27-2018 at 01:25 AM. Reason: forgot to add title

  22. #22
    SamLangHorn is offline New Member
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    Kathy,
    I have been reading your story, and was wondering how you are doing now. I noticed your last post was in late July, so I was wondering how your surgery went. I have a surgery coming up and am in a similar situation to yours, so any info at all would be helpful. Thanks!

  23. #23
    randbforever is offline New Member
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    Robert, I to am having surgery. I am terrified because I am having open heart surgery. It is scheduled July 22. I currently take anywhere from 2-4 mg a day of subs a day. My last being yesterday. Am I stopping in time to have relief with pain meds with the surgery or should I reschedule.

  24. #24
    Tommyk0813 is offline New Member
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    I have to have surgery on January 18th I'm on 4mg a day and I'm scared about the wd before the surgery and if I'll be ok after I don't want to be in pain what should I do also my Dr will not prescribe pain meds before surgery please help

  25. #25
    Tommyk0813 is offline New Member
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    Can you give me any tips 4mg a day having surgery on the 18th of this month

  26. #26
    Beefaroni7272 is offline Advanced Member
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    Default

    I had surgery back in March to have a couple of toes removed. I too was worried about it. I spoke to my doctor and he told me to stop taking it the day before my procedure. I know suboxone has a very long half life and all that good stuff. Just talk to your doctor. Let him know exactly what you are taking, ohm much, etc. The anesthesiologists know what they are doing, you should be fine. After the procedure they said I could go back on my suboxone without incident, so I waited a day and I was fine. Didn't have to re-induct or anything, I'm sure they have done this before because suboxone is widely prescribed now. Just be up front and tell them everything, they need to know your full medical history so they can determine the best course of action for you.

    Hope this helps.
    Have a great day
    Beef
    Randy35 and Lvg nghtmare like this.

  27. #27
    Randy35 is offline Platinum Member
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Tommyk0813 View Post
    I have to have surgery on January 18th I'm on 4mg a day and I'm scared about the wd before the surgery and if I'll be ok after I don't want to be in pain what should I do also my Dr will not prescribe pain meds before surgery please help

    Hi Tommy -

    Beef provided you with good advice based, and he has his own experience to draw from. I can tell you I work with lots of Suboxone patients and the best course off action depends on how much sub you are taking, and for how long you've been taking it. In your case being on 4mg daily I would completely stop taking the subs for 3 days prior to your scheduled surgery. That 4mg is a lot of sub and you also have a build up in your system depending on how long you've been taking the Suboxone. You didn't say how long, but if it's been over 2 weeks then I would allow myself plenty of time to let some of the half life of the subs to dissipate. Then you'll have no worries about any pain meds doing the job and keeping you comfortable after the surgery.

    This info is for you Tommy, and all other Suboxone patients with upcoming surgical procedures, causing concerns.

    Randy

  28. #28
    Beefaroni7272 is offline Advanced Member
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    Hey tommy, just wanted to add that after my surgery I wasn't prescribed any pain meds, so I'm sure that's why my dr. Had me go down that route. I have diminished feeling in my feet so I really didn't need the pain meds after. I would say that the three days that Randy recommended would probably be better that way the half life can catch up and you'll be ready for anything after the surgery.
    Just talk to your doctors and see what they say.

    Beef

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