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Govt. Drops Corrupt Mental Illness Program
  1. #1
    Miles is offline Member
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    Default Govt. Drops Corrupt Mental Illness Program

    GAP Client Allen Jones Vindicated After Years of Voicing Concerns of Financial Corruption

    Washington, D.C. – The director of the federal government’s mental health agency announced last week that his department no longer endorses the Texas Medication Algorithm Project (TMAP), a controversial drug treatment regime supported by President Bush. The reversal by Charles Currie, director of the Substance Abuse & Mental Health Services Administration (SAMHSA), came in a meeting on October 17 with numerous nonprofit health organization representatives. Among those present who witnessed Currie’s remarks was Government Accountability Project (GAP) client Allen Jones, who has been critical of TMAP for years and was fired as a result of investigating the program’s inner-workings.

    Jones, a former fraud investigator for the state of Pennsylvania, blew the whistle on financial inducements given by drug companies to entice state officials to favor hyper-expensive “atypical” drugs in treating depression, bipolar disorder and schizophrenia. A government-funded study released last month confirmed Jones’s findings that atypical drugs are no better in treating schizophrenia than older, off-patent medications that sell for a fraction of the cost. Jones initially began his investigation in 2002, went public with his findings in February 2004, and was terminated that following June as a result.

    The development and marketing of TMAP was financed by ten major drug companies. All of the atypical drugs are recent issues and under patent to the same drug companies that promoted the adoption of TMAP around the country. The program has come under fire from numerous therapists and citizens groups in recent years.

    “It is high time that the federal government realizes the sham that TMAP really is,” stated Jones. “This program has been a blatant example of how big corporations can manipulate and corrupt our government officials into acting in the best interest of businesses instead of the public. The states that still operate TMAP should end this corruption immediately in the interest of taxpayers everywhere.”

    While an investigator at the Pennsylvania Office of Inspector General, Jones discovered that drug companies were showering gifts on officials in charge of determining which drugs were to be prescribed to persons in state custody suffering mental illness. The exorbitant costs of these atypical drugs are being borne by taxpayers via Medicaid. Jones discovered a hidden bank account created by pharmaceuticals for Pennsylvania officials to receive monetary gifts for implementing TMAP. Jones was fired for his persistent investigating and exposing of the program.

    “SAMHSA’s rejection of TMAP completely vindicates Allen’s disclosure,” stated GAP Food & Drug Safety Director Mark Cohen, continuing “We anticipate the courts will agree.” GAP represents Jones in a federal suit in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, in which he alleges he was fired for exercising his free speech rights.


    Government Accountability Project
    The Government Accountability Project is the nation’s leading whistleblower protection organization. Through litigating whistleblower cases, publicizing concerns and developing legal reforms, GAP’s mission is to protect the public interest by promoting government and corporate accountability. Founded in 1977, GAP is a non-profit, public interest law firm with offices in Washington, D.C. and Seattle, WA.


  2. #2
    zippysgoddess is offline Platinum Member
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    You are really bored, aren't you?



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  3. #3
    bn7
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    quote:Originally posted by zippysgoddess

    You are really bored, aren't you?



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    zippysgoddess,

    That's a very funny comment from someone who's posted here 1246 times. Talk about the pot calling the kettle black??? Ha Ha Ha Ha!

    Thanks for the above article Miles, I've put it up on a few more sites and now it is spreading throughout my online network.

    Cheers!


  4. #4
    zippysgoddess is offline Platinum Member
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    I have that high number of posts, because I do a lot of drug identifying for people in the pill ID forum, and answer a lot of questions, and provide a lot of advice for those in need. I AM HELPFUL! I do not post paranoid drivel!



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  5. #5
    Miles is offline Member
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    bn7:

    You are most welcome! I respect GAP and its mission.

    (Editor) zippysgoddess:

    To reply to your tag question, "No, I am not bored, but I would wager Zippy is!"

    Miles

  6. #6
    zippysgoddess is offline Platinum Member
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    If you defend the stuff that you post about so wholeheartedly, and you think it is all substantiated, then why attack someone else to defend it, instead of letting it stand on its own merits?



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  7. #7
    Miles is offline Member
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    ziipysgoddess:

    No one is "attacking" you. I believe you are the one who prompted the retorts from bn7 and me with your tag question. You used the word "I" four times in two sentences in your first post here and you alleged that you are "helpful." You certainly have no problems with your sense of self-worth. When and where is your canonization ceremony?

    Miles

  8. #8
    zippysgoddess is offline Platinum Member
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    Actually, that was my second post, in defense of myself after the attacks started.

    You are posting paranoid drivel. Haven't you been clued in by the fact that you have a very limited number of replies to any of it?

    To top it off, you are obviously conceited.



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  9. #9
    Miles is offline Member
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    zippysgoddess:

    "You are posting paranoid drivel." And you post science? Spare me your arrogance!

    "Haven't you been clued in by the fact that you have a very limited number of replies to any of it?" Unlike you, my sense of self is not measured by replies to my posts. You seem to revel in your self-worth.

    "To top it off, you are obviously conceited." I prefer to use the term "knowledgeable."

    Miles

  10. #10
    zippysgoddess is offline Platinum Member
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    Damn, I like your attitude. I may not agree with you, but I like it! LOL! This has been great fun, but I still call it conceited!!



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  11. #11
    Miles is offline Member
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    zippygoddess:

    Ditto! Perhaps you could try seeing me (and my few allies on this site) as "passionate" and "committed" to our beliefs in personal freedom rather than as conceited. Among our most vocal critics are biopsychiatrists, drug manufacturers, and agents of the therapeutic state. Our system of beliefs leads us to defiance in the face of the medicalization of virtually every problem in life. Our postings are generally grounded in scientific research and the belief in personal responsibility and are offered merely as alternatives to current thought and practice among the therapeutic state. We welcome debate!

    Regards,
    Miles

  12. #12
    zippysgoddess is offline Platinum Member
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    Yes, Miles, I do see that. I do not have to agree with you to see your point of view, life would be very boring if we all agreed anyway.

    However, there are benefits to alternatives for people for whom traditional medicine fails. I have known many people for whom drugs, and traditional medical therapies either did not work, or they had allergies so severe they couldn't use them, and were left to suffer. For some people, the non-traditional methods have truly been a god send.

    I won't even get into those doctors whose first response is to always throw drugs at a problem, and end up with people who are over medicated, and addicted, through no fault of their own.

    There was on person on here, not too long ago, who had started some meds for a few little problems, then she suffered some side effects, so the doc gave her more meds to deal with each of those, instead of just finding her other alternatives that might cause less of a problem, she posted a list of 20 to 30 meds she was taking each day. That is way too much.

    Anyway, I would be interested in an alternative ideas, or information you have for chronic pain. But please keep in mind, I can not do such things as physical therapy, chiropractic care, extreme exercise, weight lifting, or anything that might put a physical strain on my spine whatsoever.

    I currently take Neurontin, Cymbalta, Oxycodone, and Oxycontin, and it still doesn't take care of all my pain. I must admit, I am desperate, and willing to try just about anything I can afford. LOL!





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  13. #13
    bn7
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    Zippygoddess,

    I've been bashed by psych nurses, stripped naked, strapped to a bed with leather restraints (no blanket) injected with drugs while I'm screaming for them to stop and every hour or so they slide a little door open and have a look at my distress. Many giggled. These quacks were using brain-damaging therapeutics on me in an attempt to damage my brain so I would comply with their ideology of what a "normal" person is. This treatment continued for 3 and a half years. Out of my 7-bedroom dormitory I am the only patient still alive.

    It sounds like you've never experienced anything like this have no empathy for the violence perpetrated against innocent people under the guise of treatment, which is nothing but social control that is happening everyday.

    The above experience I cite has transformed me into a mental environmentalist, fighting to stop pill-popping American spiritual emptiness from spreading across the globe that you and your kind advocate.

    I notice "from above" that you use the same method of diagnosis that many biopsychiatrist's have adopted. Anyone that does not agree with their belief system must be paranoid. I hope you never take up biopyschiatry as a profession. I'd pitty your poor clients, but I pitty all patients that suffer under this unproved (billion dollar industry) that thoughts, feelings and behavior have a medical etiology.

    I stand here defiant and ready to fight you and your kind 24/7. My friend’s deaths are my motivation.

    So instead of just gibbering psych based jargon personal attacks, why not try providing some scientific evidence to back up your pro psych platitude. I'll enjoy shooting it to pieces.

    Miles,

    If you haven't come across this site before, I'm sure you'll find it a great resource.

    http://www.ahrp.org/index.php

    Cheers!

  14. #14
    zippysgoddess is offline Platinum Member
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    Holy cow, now what brought this on? Miles, and I were just working out our differences, and realizing that we respect each other, and don't disagree on everything, but no one can agree on every little thing.

    Believe it or not, I know someone who was in a situation like what you went through, and it ruined him for life. The mental health system got ahold of him as a child, when he was orphaned. They used the claim that he needed treatment to deal with the trauma of seeing his parents die, but they never let him out of the system, so he never knew what a normal life was like. When he was an adult, and finally was able to say NO MORE, and insist on getting out on his own, he couldn't handle it, but of course, they didn't want him too, they wanted him to fail, they never wanted to let him out of the system.

    My husband suffers from mental illness, and you will never know how much I fought to make sure he didn't end up in treatment centers that would do to him the same stuff that happened to you.

    I also believe in my last post, I was talking about how much of a problem it is when docs just throw drugs at a problem, instead of actually treating the problem. I especially abhor this new trend of doing it to children.

    So, in my last post, while admitting I do not agree with everything Miles posted, I was not bashing, or attacking at all. I am very sorry you feel that way, and felt a need to attack me again.



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  15. #15
    bn7
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    zippygoddess,

    I suppose you should re-read the article at start of this thread and then your following comments and stop acting so innocent.

    It didn't take much to get you to put your tail between you legs like a frightened puppy.

    tee hee!

  16. #16
    zippysgoddess is offline Platinum Member
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    No, I am not being a frightened puppy, after the life I have lived since childhood, there are very few things that scare me, ever.

    Why must you persist in being so nasty to me, when I was trying to be nice and settle things?

    I must say that you have an awesome attitude.



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  17. #17
    zippysgoddess is offline Platinum Member
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    I will state again, there are some things about this, and your outlook that I agree with, and some I don't. That is perfectly normal in this world, and something that you just have to live with, you should not hate me, just for not agreeing with you 100%. Psych, and drugs do work for some people. Yes, your experience was awful, and I can perfectly understand why you are against it, however, not all places are like that, and treat people that awfully.

    There are other people for whom psych meds, and docs, do not work.

    There are plenty of problems, and fraud in the whole system, and there really is in all health care.

    I was at a docs appointment a month ago, and while waiting for the CRNP to get my narcotics prescriptions signed, I heard her in the hall talking to a drug rep. The drug rep was flat out telling her that certain medications were "preferred", and that the company offered certain incentives to the docs for prescribing them. That is just wrong, and illegal, too, I believe.

    You need to calm down, and chill. I do not hate you because we don't totally agree.



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  18. #18
    bn7
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    NEWS: Bush Psychiatric Screening Story Gets Award

    Exposing President Bush's Plans
    for Massive Psychiatric Screening of
    the USA Wins a "Project Censored"
    Alternative Media Award

    Project Censored is considered the
    "alternative Pulitzer Prize" by some
    journalists. This Saturday, 22 Oct.,
    Project Censored awarded the "Top 25
    Censored Stories of 2006" -- important
    news that mainstream media covers up.

    Number 11 in the Top 25 is journalist
    Jeanne Lenzer whose series of articles
    in the _British Medical Journal_ showed
    how President Bush is calling for "mental
    health screening" for children and adults
    in the USA in a plan that could result
    in hundreds of thousands of more citizens
    being placed on psychiatric drugs without
    adequate protection of human rights.

    Even though President Bush calls for
    making this psychiatric screening "common
    practice" throughout the USA the
    corporate mainstream media has largely
    refused to inform their readers.

    BELOW is the forwarded announcement
    from Project Censored including an
    UPDATE from Jeanne Lenzer:

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~

    #11 Universal Mental Screening Program
    Usurps Parental Rights

    Sources:

    Asheville Global Report (British Medical
    Journal), No. 284, June 24-30, 2004

    Title: "Bush Plans To Screen Whole U.S.
    Population For Mental Illness"

    Author: Jeanne Lenzer

    http://www.agrnews.org/issues/284/#2

    Truth News, September 13,2004

    Title: "Forcing Kids Into a Mental Health
    Ghetto"

    Congressman Ron Paul

    In April of 2002, President Bush
    appointed a 22 member commission called
    the President's New Freedom Commission on
    Mental Health in order to "identify
    policies that could be implemented by
    Federal, State and local governments to
    maximize the utility of existing
    resources, improve coordination of
    treatments and services, and promote
    successful community integration for
    adults with a serious mental illness and
    children with a serious emotional
    disturbance."1 Members of this commission
    include physicians in the mental health
    field and at least one (Robert N.
    Postlethwait) former employee of
    pharmaceutical giant Ely Lilly and Co.

    In July of 2003 the commission published
    the results of their study. They found
    that mental health disorders often go
    undiagnosed and recommended to the
    President that there should be more
    comprehensive screening for mental
    illnesses for people of all ages,
    including pre-school age children. In
    accordance with their findings, the
    commission recommended that schools were
    in a "key position" to screen the 52
    million students and 6 million adult
    employees of our nation's schools.2

    The commission also recommended linking
    the screenings with treatment and
    support. They recommended using the Texas
    Medication Algorithm Project (TMAP) as a
    model treatment system.3 TMAP, which was
    implemented in Texas' publicly funded
    mental health care system while George W.
    Bush was governor of Texas,4 is a disease
    management program that aids physicians
    in prescribing drugs to patients based on
    clinical history, background, symptoms,
    and previous results. It was the first
    program in the United States aimed at
    establishing medication guidelines for
    treating mental health illnesses.5
    Basically, it is an algorithm that
    recommends specific drugs which should be
    used to treat specific diseases. Funding
    for TMAP was provided by a Robert
    Wood-Johnson Grant as well as several
    major drug companies. The project began
    in 1995 as an alliance of individuals
    from pharmaceutical companies, the
    University of Texas, and the mental
    health and corrections systems of Texas.6

    Critics of mental health screening and
    TMAP claim that it is a payoff to
    Pharmaceutical companies. Many cite Allen
    Jones, a former employee of the
    Pennsylvania Office of the Inspector
    General. He was fired when he revealed
    that many key officials who have
    influence over the medication plan in his
    state received monetary perks and benefits
    from pharmaceutical companies, which
    benefited from their drugs being in the
    medication algorithm. TMAP also promotes
    the use of newer, more expensive
    anti-psychotic drugs. Results of studies
    conducted in the United States and Great
    Britain found that using the older, more
    established anti-psychotic drugs as a
    front line treatment rather than the
    newer experimental drugs makes more
    sense. Under TMAP, the Ely Lilly drug
    olanzapine, a new atypical antipsychotic
    drug, is used as a first line treatment
    rather than a more typical anti-psychotic
    medication. Perhaps it is because Ely
    Lilly has several ties to the Bush
    family, where George Bush Sr. was a
    member of the board of directors. George
    W. Bush also appointed Ely Lilly C.E.O.
    Sidney Taurel to a seat on the Homeland
    Security Council. Of Ely Lilly's $1.6
    million political contributions in 2000,
    82 percent went to Republicans and George
    W. Bush.7

    In November of 2004, Congress
    appropriated $20 million8 to implement
    the findings of the New Freedom
    Commission on Mental Health. This would
    include mandatory screening by schools
    for mental health illnesses. Congressman
    Ron Paul, R-Texas introduced an amendment
    to the appropriations bills which would
    withhold funding for mandatory mental
    health screenings and require parental
    consent and notification. His amendment,
    however, was voted down by a wide margin
    (95-315 in the House of
    Representatives).9 Paul, a doctor and
    long-time member of the American
    Association of Physicians and Surgeons
    (AAPS) states, "At issue is the
    fundamental right of parents to decide
    what medical treatment is appropriate for
    their children. The notion of federal
    bureaucrats ordering potentially millions
    of youngsters to take psychotropic drugs
    like Ritalin strikes an emotional chord
    with American parents." Paul says the
    allegation "that we have a nation of
    children with undiagnosed mental
    disorders crying out for treatment is
    patently false," and warns that mental
    health screening could be used to label
    children whose attitudes, religious
    beliefs, and political views conflict
    with established doctrine. Paul further
    warns that an obvious major beneficiary
    of this legislation is the pharmaceutical
    industry. The AAPS has decried this
    legislation, which they say will lead to
    mandatory psychological testing of every
    child in America without parental
    consent, and "heap even more coercive
    pressure on parents to medicate children
    with potentially dangerous side effects."

    Update by Jeanne Lenzer:

    Whether it's the pills we take or the oil
    we use, it would be reassuring to know
    that the information used to develop new
    medicines or to utilize natural resources
    wisely is based on science--not corporate
    spin.

    But blandishments from Big Pharma to
    politicians and doctors have a profound
    effect on health care in the U.S., making
    medical research closer to propaganda than
    science at times.

    One way drug companies, in collusion with
    doctors, increase their market share is to
    expand the definition of diseases. When
    diagnostic criteria were liberalized for
    attention deficit disorder in 1991, the
    number of children diagnosed jumped by
    about 60 percent.

    The American Psychiatric Association
    (APA) acknowledged in the July 2004 issue
    of Advocacy News that, "The BMJ story has
    gained some traction in derivative
    reports on the Internet." But, they
    boasted, "mainstream media have not
    touched the story, in part thanks to
    APA's work, for which the [Bush]
    Administration is appreciative."10

    The APA's boast is curious. The article
    was the most downloaded article in the
    history of the BMJ. It clearly struck a
    nerve with a public wary of doctors and
    politicians whose pockets are lined with
    drug company money.

    Given the interest in the BMJ story, it
    would seem that the APA, instead of
    attempting to keep the story out of the
    mainstream media, would be anxious to
    counter the widely circulated statements
    in the article. It would also seem that
    the mainstream press could provide the
    Administration and the APA the best
    possible vehicle to counter these
    supposed factual errors in the BMJ
    article.

    But, the facts might prove difficult to
    square with the public. More than one in
    every 100 toddlers and preschoolers in
    the United States are on powerful
    psychiatric drugs, such as Ritalin and
    Prozac, according to a study published in
    the February 2000 issue of the Journal of
    the American Medical Association.

    Joseph T. Coyle, M.D., wrote in an
    accompanying editorial, "It appears that
    behaviorally disturbed children are now
    increasingly subjected to quick and
    inexpensive pharmacologic fixes, as
    opposed to informed mutimodal therapy."
    He concluded, "These disturbing
    prescription practices suggest a growing
    crisis in mental health services to
    children and demand more thorough
    investigation."

    But instead of issuing warnings about
    overmedication or inappropriate
    prescribing, the experts on the New
    Freedom Commission warn ominously that
    too few children are receiving treatment
    for mental illness. They cite escalating
    numbers of toddlers expelled from daycare
    as evidence of potentially serious
    psychological problems--problems to be
    diagnosed and cured with mental health
    screening and pills. Social and economic
    reasons for the rise in kiddie expulsions
    are left unexamined.

    As bad as this is for those put on drugs
    and labeled "mentally ill," the far
    bigger concern is the creation of a
    disease for every drug, a situation made
    possible by the hand-in-glove
    relationship between industry and the
    government.

    So much for paranoid drivel?
    Last edited by Anonymous; 02-04-2016 at 07:27 PM.

  19. #19
    zippysgoddess is offline Platinum Member
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    I stopped calling it all paranoid drivel, when I began to understand where you were coming from.

    Yes, this is definitely wrong, mandator mental health screening, and forcing someone into treatment is just plain ridiculous, and unacceptable.

    When my son was younger, they wanted to slap him on ADHD drugs right away, based on him being playful, and they said his HANDWRITING is characteristic of it. Give me a break, he is a normal little boy, just maybe a little immature for his age when he was younger, because we had no other kids his age living near us, and he did not go to preschool, so interaction with other kids wasn't a regular thing for him. He had to make some adjustments. Now at 10, he is fine, without drugs, because I refused to let them put him on them.

    Our government, teachers, social workers, and etc. want to prevent kids from acting up, or prevent crime, by turning everyone they can into drugged robots. No one wants to actually handle anything, or deal with anything anymore.

    Kids should run, play, and make noise, we should not drug them into calmness.

    There are even parents who lost their kids, because they refused to give them drugs like Ritalin, when teachers or others recommended it.

    You have got me on a subject here that I feel very strongly about, forcing meds, and treatment like that is just plain wrong, and against everyone's civil rights.



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  20. #20
    zippysgoddess is offline Platinum Member
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    Oh, by the way, it would appear the you don't sleep either! LOL!



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  21. #21
    bn7
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    zippygoddess,

    OK, it appears you're not a hard line bio-psychiatrist advocate as you first appeared to be, so I will retract my talons.

    I live in OZ. I went to bed at 10.30 pm. I have no problems sleeping. In fact it's my favorite hobby.

  22. #22
    zippysgoddess is offline Platinum Member
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    Thanks, those suckers were sharp. Oz???



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  23. #23
    bn7
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    Australia.

  24. #24
    zippysgoddess is offline Platinum Member
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    Ah, okay, forgive my ignorance there. Any roos in the back yard? It appears they are popular here in the US, but pests in their native country.



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  25. #25
    bn7
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    I live on the southern part of the Great Dividing Range in a forest. So yes I get a lot of wildlife, I don't get a lot of roo's but when I do it's usually heaps, 60 or more. Wallabies hang around most of the year. I get lots of koalas and everything else + loads of snake’s predominately brown snakes (the deadliest in the world). Luckily a huge black snake has moved onto my property this year, there very territorial and the browns piss off when blacks are around. I'm just very aware of snakes at the moment, I'm using a weed whacker (bush fire prevention) and I'm seeing lots of them.

    Roo's aren't a pest, they are protected. All the wildlife is (especially with me around LOL). There is a trust fund where you can join and your land becomes "land for wildlife". I joined that trust years ago. I'm re-vegetating my land with indigenous plants, I have been for years. I propagate indigenous trees and donate them to the community.

    If I sound like an environmentalist I am. I am also very concerned about the mental environment too. That’s why I post here.

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    Hey Zippy and bn7, what up wit that Spa King guy? I saw ya'll ran into him on anouther post. He was a complete jerk to my friend who also posted on this site. He told her, her daughter was a whore. Someone needs to get him off here. Have a good day.

    Girlie Girl

  27. #27
    bn7
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    girlie girl,

    Thank's I'll ignore him from now on.

  28. #28
    zippysgoddess is offline Platinum Member
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    That jerk Spa King has made more posts with various insults, he isn't worth anyones time, he hasn't made a single worthwhile post.

    bn7, that is so awesome. Now you really caught my attention, I love animals, and hate when people mistreat them.

    My husband is in college, and it was a student from Australia who told him they were pests. Sorry about that, I guess it all depends on how you feel about animals.

    I used to be a cat rescuer, as a matter of fact my last rescuee is still a family member, and 2 years old now, smartest, and sweetest cat I've ever had. I adore and spoil every animal I see, there is a stray outside who always knows where to come for a free meal, if the dish outside is empty, he sits and cries outside my window, because he knows I will run and fill it.

    Sorry for my prior defensiveness on meds, my husband was suicidal, and at that time they were the only thing that saved him, since then though, he has gotten off most of them, as the behavioral, and mental therapies helped more than anything else.



    My information is not guaranteed correct. I do not get them right all the time, but I do enjoy the hunt~

  29. #29
    bn7
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    Zippygoddess,

    I'll get the bad bit out of the way first.

    I have 14 mates that all committed suicide whilst taking psychiatric medication. Psychiatric medication has a very common side effect called Akathisia (Extreme Agitation). This was the cause of my friends suicide a 7 attempts of my own.

    As there is no known cause for a single mental illness, so the best psychiatry can come up with are medications that work by disabling the brain. There is no evidence that these meds decrease suicide and violence, there is plenty of evidence that it increases the risk of suicide and violence.

    In the case of your husband (without trying to sound rude or that I have no empathy) it sounds like he was depressed? Have you read all the evidence on anti-depressant trials and the placebo effect?

    The problem with psychiatry is that they have aligned themselves with the Billion-dollar psychopharmacology industry, to the extent that a myth now exists that "mental Illness" is caused by chemical imbalances that can only be fixed by their products.

    There is absolutely no proof that this is the case. The US Surgeon General's report into mental illness does not cite a single know cause for a singe mental illness. Yet psychiatrists use extremely powerful toxic damaging drugs based on a premature guess that madness has a biological cause. It is more than a guess though; the Billion Dollar drug companies have a vested interest in ensuring bio-psychiatric treatment is used.

    Many ethical psychiatrist’s point to the social, cultural and environmental causes of madness, but they hardly get heard. The big money is in the bio-psychiatry, drugs companies pay for pre-outcome research. There is plenty of evidence that if we life awful lives that we cannot escape we will go mad. It's obvious. Well that’s enough of that!

    Cats are a bit of a problem here, well feral cats especially. You can hire feral cat traps, (which does not harm them in anyway) and a vet can put down the caught feral cat. I wish the original owners of these cats could be tracked down and put down + pet cats in the bush must be de-sexed. Feral cats have decimated the birdlife, reptile and small mammal population in this country. We have a lot of introduced pests. Last week I had a huge fight with a govt department that were all setup to spray an area of noxious weeds. The problem was it was a wetland full of frogs, it's mid breeding time. It took a week of phone calls and emails but I stopped it. It will now be sprayed in Feb when all the frogs have burroughed underground to avoid the summer heat. I'm happy I stopped those idiots and saved the frogs.

  30. #30
    zippysgoddess is offline Platinum Member
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    Well first of all I have to congratulate you on saving the frogs, good job, and I am glad you didn't give up, even though it took many phone calls. I once carried one in, very gently, just to show my cats, it a was a big one I found in the yard, I didn't let them harm him, just want to see their reaction. They sniffed, then when he began to hop around the room, they ran from him. LOL! I have four cats total, and they are all neutered, the one outside is the one I feel really bad about though, as he is neutered, and declawed, so he should not be roaming in the wild. There are neighbors who claim he is theirs, but they sure do not feed him or take care of him, and it disgusts me. My three youngest cats, two of which are brothers, are all rescuees, someone had them, who let their feline population get out of control, and when the inbreeding occured, with resulting illnesses, they were just letting them suffer, and I couldn't stand that. I carried them home, treated them myself, on veterinary advice, and the brothers are now 4, and the youngest 2.

    I am glad to hear that they humanely trap them, and gently put them down, instead of being cruel and nasty as happens in some countries.


    Now on to the other subject, (seems we are now becoming friends!) yes, my DH was, and still is chronically depressed. As I said, behavioral, and cognitive therapies have done more for him than the drugs ever did. Almost all of the drugs he was on had severe adverse effects, and caused more problems than they were worth. He is down to one of them now, which helps with his anxiety and panic attacks. Part of his problem was also unknown, and uncontrolled diabetes, which can have a detrimental effect on anyone.

    Yes, I have read tons of the information on antidepressant trials, and the placebo effect. They really like to push these drugs, and say they solve all these problems, and claim to know the cause, but they really have no clue, they came up with theories, and try to state them as fact. I honestly believe that giving them to people, creates problems, especially the younger children, who are taking them while their own bodies are forming, and in an uproar. By messing around with certain chemicals in the brain, such as seratonin, we can literally make the body "forget" how to produce it, because it learns to rely on these drugs, then they can never safely get off these drugs, and are stuck on them for life.

    And of course, our government makes money from all these drug companies as well, so they sure don't want people to stop using psychotropics, they would lose too much income.

    I am very sorry to hear how many people you have lost to drug induced suicides, and of your own attempts. I am glad you learned the truth before you tried again and succeeded. The tragedy is all to real, and all to often glossed over in the media, and medical journals.

    I have a friend whose daughter was a total uncontrollable child, basically just because her mother never taught her what the word "no" means, and never disciplined her, so the child had temper tantrums all the time, which the mother could no longer handle. She has now taken the child to so many doctors, and put her on so many drugs it is incredible. Even stuff that is not tested, or approved for use in children. Since their divorce, he has sent me many an anxious note to identify a certain pill, and let him know what it was for, needless to say we are all scared to death for this poor little girl and her future. She is now 7, and has already taken more drugs in her short years on earth, than I, at 34, have taken in my whole life.



    My information is not guaranteed correct. I do not get them right all the time, but I do enjoy the hunt~

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