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help with methadone detox
  1. #61
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    I don't really know anything about subutex. What is the difference between subutex and methadone, is it less addictive? and is there really any benefit to switching from one addictive medication to another? Isn't it messed up what we put ourselves through for years because we didn't want to spend a few days being sick?

  2. #62
    newyorkgal is offline Advanced Member
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    Corrinne, It's BEYOND messed up what we've put ourselves through, thats for sure.
    Methadone and subutex are both opiate replacement therapies and both are addictive but methadone is used as a long term treatment while subutex/suboxone is a shorter term drug. It's advised that someone on methadone get down to 30 mgs. or lower before making the switch to sub. Then you have to go approximately 72 hours taking nothing until you are in withdrawal before starting the sub. The good thing is within a short time after taking the sub, all withdrawal symptoms are gone. If done properly, a sub taper can be done in a much shorter time frame than a meth taper. There are several people on this forum who could guide your boyfriend through a taper if thats what he decides to do. Do a search online at suboxone.com then plug in your zip to see how many doctors are in your area that perscribe sub. It's an easier way than getting off methadone alone. See https://www.drugs.com/forum/featured...apy-50887.html for information.

  3. #63
    noda0508 is offline New Member
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    Question Help With Methadone

    Hi. My name is Somer and this is my first time on this, or any, forum. I have been on Methadone now for almost two and a half years, at 100 mg daily, after 5 years of shooting up oxy's. (Anywhere from 240mgs to 640 mgs daily.) I REALLY want to get off of Methadone, but am COMPLETELY scared to death!! I can't afford to have ANY HEAVY withdrawals as I am a SINGLE mother of two young children and I have to be able to take care of them. I know there is NO WAY OUT without experiencing some withdrawals, but am wondering what route to take that would cause the least severe ones. If anyone has any suggestions as to what to do, I would GREATLY appreciate it. Thanks so much!
    Last edited by Anonymous; 11-01-2009 at 11:56 PM. Reason: left something out

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by noda0508 View Post
    Hi. My name is Somer and this is my first time on this, or any, forum. I have been on Methadone now for almost two and a half years, at 100 mg daily, after 5 years of shooting up oxy's. (Anywhere from 240mgs to 640 mgs daily.) I REALLY want to get off of Methadone, but am COMPLETELY scared to death!! I can't afford to have ANY HEAVY withdrawals as I am a SINGLE mother of two young children and I have to be able to take care of them. I know there is NO WAY OUT without experiencing some withdrawals, but am wondering what route to take that would cause the least severe ones. If anyone has any suggestions as to what to do, I would GREATLY appreciate it. Thanks so much!
    there is a way out somer, subs, but you have to get down to around 30mg before you can change over. beleive me i have tried coming off methadone a few times in the past, swearing i would never go back, but i did.
    i managed to get myself roughly down to 30mg, and did a bit of a dodgy switch over, however made it,
    i counted from 14mg of subs, to 1mg over a period of 3-4 months.

    it is possible pal, thats what you have to aim for. 30mg, then go subs.
    have a read of my thread sub taper <2mg,
    its been relatively uneventful, despite my fears, in fact my fear was much more than any symptoms i have encountered,
    mainly stretching in the very early mornings.
    you do your research pal, there is a way off methadone though.
    cheeky

  5. #65
    newyorkgal is offline Advanced Member
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    To add to what cheeky just said, it should not be hard at all to go from 100 mgs. methadone to 30 mgs. You can go in 10 or 5 mgs. increments every couple of weeks. Take you time with it but there should be no bad feelings til you get to the low doses at which point you can slow it down even further. Then when you get to 30, listen to what cheeky said, investigation switching to subutex. Tapering from that is close to painless.

  6. #66
    noda0508 is offline New Member
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    Thank you so much for replying! How much does it cost to get on Suboxone? I have a list of docs. in my area that prescribe it. Does it make you feel like Methadone? What are the withdrawal symptoms like? Aren't subs just about like Methadone as far as "swapping one for the other?" I heard people say that that's what Methadone was, "swapping one for the other," but didn't believe it at first. Now, I totally agree!!! I am now "strung out" on Methadone probably worse than the Oxy's as I have heard from countless people that the withdrawals are WAY worse!!! Just need a little more info before making a decision to switch! Thanks again so much!

  7. #67
    noda0508 is offline New Member
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    Question Suboxone Information

    Hi. This is Somer again. I just called and spoke with the doctor's office in my area that prescribes Suboxone. I was just wondering what it makes you feel like. Anyone who has been on Methadone knows that it has a tendency to make you sleepy. Does Suboxone do the same? Do you experience ANY withdrawals coming down from it? Does it taste bad? How long does it last? Any response is much appreciated!!!

    p.s.- I found out the price for Suboxone from the docs. office.
    Last edited by Anonymous; 11-02-2009 at 12:06 PM. Reason: left something out

  8. #68
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    New York gal: thanks for the info. It was very helpful. They offer Subutex at my clinic, I will be going in the AM to get some information on it for my husband.

    Somer: I just learned about this medication too. I'm too low already but my husband is at 30ml of methadonw. I have a whole list of questions to ask the clinic tomorrow. I will share w/ you the information I get if you still need it.

  9. #69
    noda0508 is offline New Member
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    That would be GREAT! I will be going shortly for the initial consultation, but it will be a while before I get to 30 mg on Methadone and am able to start Suboxone. But yeah, I would appreciate all of the information you could give me.

  10. #70
    newyorkgal is offline Advanced Member
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    I understand your concern about swapping out one drug for another but there really are vast differences between sub and methadone. First of all, suboxone does not generally make you feel sleepy at all. It doesnt make you high, it doesnt make you sick. It basically makes you feel normal if taken correctly. It does have the druggy effect that meth does. The main difference between the two is this. When you get on methadone, it is generally accepted that its for the long haul. Most people are on methadone for years. While some doctors will tell you subutex is also a long term drug, its not true. There are people on this board who can help you with a taper plan, which, if done correctly, will have you off everything within a couple of months relatively pain free. Get your information here before listening to a doctor. Alot of them give bad information such as starting people on way too high a dose and leaving them on too long as opposed to tapering off. Go to Featured Drugs on this forum then look for a sticky called Suboxone-Subutex induction (or close)... Read that for further information. Somer, in answer to your other questions, it doesnt taste too bad at all, not delicious but not awful either. Its perscribed as a twice a day drug but in Europe and Australia its only given once a day. Either way, it has a very long half life so it lasts all day.

  11. #71
    noda0508 is offline New Member
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    New York Gal, thank you so much for your time to answer my questions! I think this will definitely be the road I take! I really appreciate your caring and kindness to help a complete stranger! Could I have your e-mail address so that I may direct any further questions directly to you? Mine is noda0508@att.net. Thank you, again, so much!

  12. #72
    newyorkgal is offline Advanced Member
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    in my post above i wrote "it does have the druggy feeling that meth does". Of course what i meant to say is "It does NOT have the druggy feeling that meth does". Sorry.

  13. #73
    newyorkgal is offline Advanced Member
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    somer, i tried to email you at the email you provided but it bounced back and said "permanent error"..... do you have another email you can give me? If not I'll just give you mine.

  14. #74
    noda0508 is offline New Member
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    No. That's the right one. If you don't mind, just give me yours and then when I send you an e-mail, you can save mine that way.

  15. #75
    newyorkgal is offline Advanced Member
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    blrubock@yahoo.com. Speak to you soon.

  16. #76
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    somer, ive done methadone, and all sorts of other opiates, and for the first time im on an opiate that isnt as sedating as methadone.
    you seem to have a clearer head, and more energy.
    and its a damn sight easier to taper off, i have gone from 14 to 1 in 4 months. and im pretty stoked for myself.
    so go for it, read around here lots, im so glad i found this site, otherwise my uninformed doctor would probably still have me on 12 or more.

    even tho on subs you kind of feel "normal', your eyes are still pinpricked, and you certainly do not feel any kind of withdrawl. and on each level when i dropped i had no issues. its all good.

    hope that answers any questions. any more feel free to ask.
    later
    cheeky

  17. #77
    lawrencerach74 is offline New Member
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    I have been using Suboxone for a little over a year. My drug of choice was narcotic pain killers. It ruined my life and at one point I almost lost my only son. It was my fault but none the less the narcotics played a huge role in the decisions that I made and my reasoning. I became hooked after a physician prescribed the medication to me for over a year and then cut me off without taking me off the medication slowly.

    Suboxone is very expensive but many insurance companies are starting to pay for it. It is the only detoxification drug that I haved used that produces no desire to take narcotics, it is less drowsy (especially after using if for awhile), and if you do take a narcotic, you start having sweats and feelings of detoxification you would have from detoxing from narcotics. It is very difficult to stop taking the drug long enough to start taking narcotics again which is a blessing. I have found great help with this drug and would take nothing else.
    I am back in school with only a year to go before my degree is finished. My son is happy and healthy as well as myself. This drug is classified as a narcotic but only resembles narcotics and escalading dosing does nothing for you if you take more than 24 mg a day. It is much harder to abuse and again is the only thing that keeps me from using other drugs.
    Finding a doctor who will prescribe it is very difficult and may also charge a great deal of money. My primary care physician happily received the qualifications needed to prescribe it and I only pay my copay but in contrast when I started using it, I paid 300 dollars a month. If you go to www.suboxone.com there is a list of physicians by State. It would be worth any cost to take this medication and get ones life back. I also suggest checking with physicians in your area who may be willing to treat and write the medication without having to go to a clinic or expensive private practice.

    God Bless and Best of Luck in your search.

  18. #78
    lawrencerach74 is offline New Member
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    many of the places one can get a prescription for Suboxone require you to pay hundreds of dollars for five minutes of treatment. I have to agree that you should either find a doctor who will not make his living off your monthly payment and cares about you or find someone who has detoxed successfully from suboxone to help you lower your dose. I think it is a shame that many times the only place to receive the much needed medication is from drug dealers with a medical degree who are suppose to help. Luckily, in my case, my primary care provider decided to help me after speaking with him about my progress and success. My brother is a physician and believes these clinics are masked drug dealers who only care about the bottom line but in the end sometimes one has to go to them to receive the much needed help as suboxone is certainly the only medication that I have taken that makes me feel normal and the longest time I have been off drugs.

  19. #79
    lawrencerach74 is offline New Member
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    walgreens has the lowers price a little less than 7 dollars a pill but check with www.suboxone.com and see if they will give you a discount. They also have a list of providers as well as check with your primary care provider. Also, check with any drug testing facilities that do drug tests for companies as well as see patients. The doctors are qualified to write suboxone for you. Many times is you talk with the physician and explain the costs, he or she will write it for you as long as you go to them each month and do random drug tests as well as many times they have a 3 strike rule.

  20. #80
    lawrencerach74 is offline New Member
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    The only problem with subutex is that you can take it with pain killers. It is fine for rapid detox but if you are long term than the best one is suboxone because of the additional drug that causes a reaction to narcotics when taking together with it. No one wants to feel withdrawls and of course if you do take it, you dont even feel the narcotic so why take it. Suboxone is much better than subutex. Just my opinion. Methadone is just another narcotic and can be abused.

  21. #81
    newyorkgal is offline Advanced Member
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    Subutex is alot cheaper than suboxone because it now comes in generic formulation. You are mistaken about the nalaxone added to the suboxone. It is added so that people cannot SHOOT the subuxone. It is barely ingested at all and will only make you ill if you shoot or snort the sub. You will not feel other oppiates at all if you are on suboxone OR subutex so in my book, subutex is the better choice, just based on price alone.

  22. #82
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    lawrence are you on 24mg of sub after one year. shizza, thats a lot.. i was readin thru, apologies if i am mistaken, but thats what it looked like.
    nyg is correct, subutex and suboxone, both are the same thing, buprenorphine, so they bind to our opiate receptors very strongly, so no other opiate can get in. so dont know where you get your info from but its wrong.
    and naloxone is only to prevent shooting it up. like old junkies like me who might be tempted to shoot it up.

    but you cannot take subutex with painkillers. that is plain wrong pal.

    and what does are you on. this stuff is not to bad to taper down on, get to a low dose and see how you go. dont stay on high doses, you will get a big habit.

  23. #83
    LucyGoose is offline Member
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    Glad for the info about Subutex >> Suboxone from both you and Cheeky. I think I had been told the same by the Dr. I was suppose to get on a program with, he wanted Suboxone because of the nalaxone, but he doesn't know me, I am Not a patient risk for abusing it.
    Naturally here in Canada, the prices and availability are quite different. I am going to call the pharmacy here and find out the cost difference. I also have to re confirm with my Health Insurance co. that it is indeed covered.They should ! They covered all the Oxycontin that started this dam mess.
    Just wondered what Robert's choice for this. Because I want to work closely with him during my taper.

  24. #84
    Robert_325 is offline Diamond Elite
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    I prefer subutex unless you are an IV drug user.

  25. #85
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    lucy, there are plenty of people who will be willing to still help you here.
    intelmetal knows his stuff, as do others.

    keep in touch goosey

  26. #86
    erinprice76 is offline New Member
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    Hello, everyone.
    My husband has been on suboxone for a year. Because the program has so many people waiting to get on suboxone, he was forced off of it. His doctors referred him to a methadone clinic in the area. He started on methadone(don't know how many mg) about 1 week ago. He has tried in the past to detox from suboxone with no success. He was VERY irritable, lethargic, vomiting, diarrhea, shaking, etc. You name it, he experienced it. After reading all these posts about switching from methadone to suboxone, I'm worried that he will have an equally horrific experience when he's ready to detox from methadone. He doesn't want to take ANYTHING! Since he's been taking the methadone, he's been feeling tired, euphoric, dysphoric, angry, happy. Does anyone have any suggestions, insight?

  27. #87
    doc.rose is offline Senior Member
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    I don't know the answer to your question, but someone will. Hang in there and you will get the answers you need.

  28. #88
    EricaMarie is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by erinprice76 View Post
    Hello, everyone.
    My husband has been on suboxone for a year. Because the program has so many people waiting to get on suboxone, he was forced off of it. His doctors referred him to a methadone clinic in the area. He started on methadone(don't know how many mg) about 1 week ago. He has tried in the past to detox from suboxone with no success. He was VERY irritable, lethargic, vomiting, diarrhea, shaking, etc. You name it, he experienced it. After reading all these posts about switching from methadone to suboxone, I'm worried that he will have an equally horrific experience when he's ready to detox from methadone. He doesn't want to take ANYTHING! Since he's been taking the methadone, he's been feeling tired, euphoric, dysphoric, angry, happy. Does anyone have any suggestions, insight?
    wow so sorry to hear that; it has to be rough what you're going thru. Hopefully after this post, some of the more experienced people on this forum will read and be able to give you a better explanation. I go to a clinic as well and have been for a year now. I could be way off base here but i'm assuming perhaps his dose is too high. If you could find out exactly how many mg's he is on it would help when some of the more experienced posters come on here. Alot of the side effects you explained is what happens when you are on too high of a dose of methadone....that is when you;ll start to experience some of the things you mentioned. Good luck, keep in touch, and I hope it gets better for you both....

  29. #89
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    mate that is pretty rough, considering most people go from methadone TO suboxone, coz its easier to taper off.
    well firstly, yep methadone will make you more "stoned" really, it is a full agonist, as opposed to subs which are a partial agonist.
    so methadone, comes with its sedation, and for me lack of motivation, and lots of other stuff.
    and it is harder to taper down off. ive managed once, but really i was using on the side anyway, coz it was too hard.
    when your hubby tried to get off subs, did he taper right down. or try and get off a high dose.
    and yeh you need to know what dose he is on. maybe they started him a bit high. its a battle to come off methadone, you have to go a lot lot slower than subs, and even then symptoms suck to the max.
    i wish you all the best, that is awful that they did that, is it even legal. can he go somewhere else and get back on subs and taper properly.
    its hard to answer ya without all the info. but man i wish you all the best. thats a raw deal if i ever saw one.

    cheeky
    ex opiate, ex methadone, nearly ex subs. (if i finally hurry up)

  30. #90
    SerinityPlease is offline New Member
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    Default Methadone

    I have not read all of the posts listed so I apologize in advance if I am repeating any information. I used drugs for 7 years, >>>>>> was the one that finally got to me, after using intervieniously for 3 years I decided to quit. I was, at this time introduced to methadone. It was great! I wasn't sick, I felt good all day. This lasted only a few months. When I decided to taper at month 4 I discovered that I was pregnant and I was then informed that I would not be allowed to taper. I have been on methadone since Novemeber 2007 excluding one slip when I tried to switch to subs. If you switch to suboxone and you have any opiates in your system then you will kick on the withdrawals. There is something in it called narcon, this is also what they use when you go into the hospital for an opiate overdose. It kicks it out of your system. This is why when you are using subs for a >>>>>> or painkiller addiction they tell you to wait until you are as sick as you can take, wait another two hours and then take it. With meth. they tell you to get down to 30 mgs usually and then not dose the next day, wait till withdrawls are at their worst, give it another two hours and then you are good to go. Meth. has a horrible, awful, painstaking half life that causes those withdrawals that the subs bring out to kick in. I would suggest going 72 without ANY methadone to switch to the subs. However, the beniphuemophine (however u spell it) will have nearly the same withdrawals as >>>>>> in my opinion. If u can go 72 hours, KEEP GOING!!! I had done this one other time to come off of the >>>>>>, got up to 12 mgs of the subs and couldnt afford them so i quit cold turkey after going two weeks on them. This would have been tollerable if I wasn't still deep into my addiction and if I was in a safe enviroment. I am now looking into getting off of methadone. I am looking into the Ultra Rapid Detix, if anyone has any info on this I would appreciate it. I have tried to taper, never more then 1 a week but you can only go so low before u begin to feel death creeping up on you (so to speak of course) so I am trying to find a sedated detox. I don't know what else to do, I can be drugged up and sick for a couple of weeks with 3-5 months of slight withdrawals, I can spend the next 3 years going down and feeling like sh*t everyday, or I can stay in the clinic and be sick every morning and every night and allow myself to stay deep into this addiction. I feel as if my head is recovered (it will never be fully recovered but I am more then stable) and my body is still deep in the addiction. I need my body and my head to be in the same place. I would appreciate any advice and I hope that this helps someone, anyone out there. Thanks for letting me take up your time, good luck.

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