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Short opiate detox with suboxone (3 weeks)
  1. #1
    LayBak is offline New Member
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    Default Short opiate detox with suboxone (3 weeks)

    Ive been searching the internet for a while about short term suboxone therapy for quitting opiates but it doesnt seem as if much info is readily available. So now i would like to share my experience in hopes that it will help the next individual.

    A little background to start, i recently (last march) surrendered over 9 years of sobriety to see if the game changed, turns out everything is still the same. I developed a 50 to 100 dollar daily habit. This habit lasted until September 19th when i decided enough was enough. I had a script for suboxone and had about 30 8 mg's when i decided to stop visiting that doc in august. The reason it took another month to "get it right" is because i tried to quit twice but took it too early and sent myself into precipitated w/d's. This last time i waited almost 48 hours to be sure it would work, and it did and had a great effect on my W/D's.

    So i induced myself on Thursday morning Sept 21st. Shortly after i was at 75% myself. I used 2mg around noon and another 2 mg around 8pm. My doctor told me i needed to use 8mg twice a day but i knew my best intrests where not his top priority. The following sched goes as:
    Day 2: 2mg noon .5mg 7pm
    Day 3: 2mg noon 2mg 8pm
    Day 4: 1mg noon .5mg 7pm

    Day 2 had a bigger second does because what i had going on in life and i was full of fear thinking i wouldnt be able to function during it. After day 4 i moved to 1mg once a day. By this time i read every suboxone thread on the internet and was scared about becoming dependent and the w/d's from it. I stayed on 1 mg from day 5 till day 8. On day 9 i jumped to .5 where i stayed from day 9 to 14. On day 14 i jumped to .25 where i stayed untill day 16, skipped day 17 and took .25 day 18 (October 8th). It has been roughly 60 hours since my last .25 dose (day 18). I feel even at a 72 hour half life ive metabolized the majority of suboxone in my system. I feel great kno that. I have been supplimenting with clonidine when i get chills or sweats but i dont like the lack of energy because of it.

    The reason i chose this route was because my first experience with suboxone was in a rehab center in Brighton Mich. I recieved subs through the 3 day detox and was then cut off, but i felt way better than any other detox. During my current tapper i did feel slight W/D's but not to the point I couldnt work nor function. Honestly you need to experience the pain and agony of opiate withdrawl. Its an important part of the recovery process. If quitting H or pills was as simple as turning on or off a light switch, then this web site wouldnt exist, along with things like NA. The fear of relapsing and going through this again will stay with you forever.

    But to stay on topic, roughly 60 hours has passed and still minimum to no W/d yet. I understand some people will say that it needs to be 3 to 5 days, but even with saturation from daily use, i should only have about .2mg of sub left to metabolize. At a dose of that level, roughly 5 to 10% of my receptors are being used. Meaning the other 90% are not agitated and causing sever w/d. Originally i wanted to only use subs for a week, but my fear kept me from doing this. I understand this goes against Roberts plan but every path to recovery is different and is contingent on the individuals factors and support network.

    I realize now that fear played a big part from keeping me from jumping. Truth is, those who really want it, will go through it. It wasnt all sunshine and lollipops, it was alot of meetings and determination along with accepting the mild w/d's and trying to offset with exercise. I hope this helps any individual who has made it past the detox of opiates but are too afraid to make the jump or taper from suboxone. I understand the brain chemistry change during using, and maybe for the firstimer a long time sub maintanence plan will be better, but i kno what is beyond the curve for me. Cravings, using dreams, things of that nature. Truly i feel that if i am going to make it at this point, it will have more to do with the quality of a program im working than an orange film.

    Once again i hope this helps, and i will try and make best an effort to give status updates about my condition over the next week weeks.

  2. #2
    LayBak is offline New Member
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    Quick update: it has been 72 hours (my earlier calc of 60 hours was about 10 to many) complete with no suboxone. My last dose was last Sunday Oct 8th at 11 a.m. (.25mg). So how am I feeling? I feel great, i have a very mild fatigue which is alot better than the first day with out suboxone, my appitite has been back since around day 5 of using suboxone after inital detox of H. I also have some stomach issues that i use immodium to resolve. I dont seem to be getting hot flashes or chills anymore (since yesterday) and since im not i will not be using my clonidine in the day, only at bed time, this is because clonidine gives me major fatigue to the point i need to nap and that doesnt go well at work. I also have a script for tizanidine and trazodone that my family doc wrote me a few months back. Its basically the standard opiate withdrawl package minus the subs. So as for sleep, im getting enough. The overall first few nights were rough af, but now im sleeping from 10pm till 630 am. I also have a 1 year old that affects my sleep however i do not take the trazadone every night in fear of dependence.

    Its amazing how fearful i was of the unknowen. I knew getting sober would be uncomfortable, but any big change comes with that in some sense. What kept me from taking the big steps were my images of the agony of withdrawls. I swear a quick taper is not so bad. If you do it aggressivley like i did, you will experience very mild (but bareable) symptoms inbetween dropping doses. Seeing how things are getting better im not infear of tomorrow or the "gotta wait 5 days before the sub withdrawls hit" theory. Im 5'11, 34, 180 (lost 60 lbs over 6 months because of coke and h) i play outdoor soccer twice a week. Im very active so i assume i have a fast metabolism. I think im closer to the mean of 37 hours than the max of 72 hours and in saying that i have been through 2 half lifes since my last dose putting me around .1mg which is negligable to say the least. I will send another update tom around this time.

  3. #3
    GiantNY is offline New Member
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    Good luck. Im 67 days free from oxy and did it with a 5 day suboxone taper. Probably more difficult in the long term than Robert's plan but doable. Everything is possible if you set your mind to it. Robert set the plan since most ppl do relapse after a little while. Keep it up. Hard part is getting off, harder part is staying off.

  4. #4
    LayBak is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by GiantNY View Post
    Good luck. Im 67 days free from oxy and did it with a 5 day suboxone taper. Probably more difficult in the long term than Robert's plan but doable. Everything is possible if you set your mind to it. Robert set the plan since most ppl do relapse after a little while. Keep it up. Hard part is getting off, harder part is staying off.
    Thats the truth Giant, hardest part is staying off. Detox or withdrawls are a short term battle in the big scheme of things, staying off is an everyday battle for the rest of your time. Im proof after losing over 9 years of sobriety last Feb/March. But im also lucky cause i was given another chance.

    So i am in my 96th hour (4 days) of no suboxone and ive been thinking alot of when would one start counting hours or days. Since suboxone has a long half life, at least the bup, do i get to count starting after last dose or should there be some time before i start counting? Either way its a miracle....

    So a run down of my current symptoms, chills and hot flashes seem to have left me before 72 hours, if i do experience them it is not really noticable. Plus, im ip in Michigan and its chilly and raining over last 36 to 48 hours. My stomach is still a little messed up but is easily cured by immodium. No RLS sonce like day 5 off of H so its been 18 days since that roughly. Im extremly active and play alot of soccer so im unsure of what the slight muscle aches are from. My last game was Sunday, Mon and Tuesday I had bad aches but extremely mild yesterday and gone today so i think i know the cause of them and its not related to W/D. I have another game tonight so ill report on them again tom lol. Sleep....last night i initally took nothing. I slept from 9 til midnight and woke up wide awake. After an hour I took a chlonidine and went lights out till 6 when my 1 year old awoke. Chlonidine makes me a zombie. As far as fatigue, its not really an issue. Like i heard others say it comes and goes, and when im going through it, it only lasts 30 minutes or so.

    So in short, currently starting day 5 with no subs and day 24 no H I feel great. I feel as good physically as i did when i was just maintaining my habit so i wasnt sick, which is big because i strived to feel and was consumed by fear when i didnt. Also i realize, i prolonged my jump because what people had to say about stopping suboxone and the horrible W/D's. I paid the price during my tapper which was extremly bareable. The quick detox/tapper worked because i suffered a little between jumps, used subs for a short period and stuck to tapper no matter what. I realize that every persons path to sobriety is different, and what i currently did may not work for others, but please dont let your path be defined with fear from possible withdrawls. Your wasting time, there will be a little suffering but it will be minimal if you do it correctly. Have a good day!
    Beefaroni7272 likes this.

  5. #5
    Catrina is offline Diamond Member
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    You can and should begin to count your days just as soon as you want to! It's true that the half life of subs is many, many hours--as many as 72 with a median of 37. I have little doubt that if you were to test for the presence of subs, even after these four days you'd likely still test positive. So what? You haven't used anything and the clock has been ticking. Count 'em up if it's important to you. Truth is, the only day that counts is this one anyway. This is a complete life style change but still, keeping track is a strong motivator for most of us, especially at the beginning. I was always h*ll bent on keeping track of days, hours and even minutes but something different happened with me this time. It wasn't very long at all and I completely lost track. All I can tell you is that my last Day 1 was early in January 2010. The date? No clue.

    You're slaying it so congratulations!! Keep posting. It's important not only for you but for others who stumble upon this site frightened and desperate. Remember the first time you looked for help here? I remember for me, I'll tell you that much. Terrified. But by reading thread after thread and seeing for myself that there are others who were able to get sober and survived to tell about it, gave me the resolve that I could too. This stuff is too good not to share!!

    Peace,

    Cat
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  6. #6
    LayBak is offline New Member
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    Thanks Cat for the positive support. I try to fill my head with either positive or non-substance abuse related things while im going through this phase of recovery. So I caught my self reading Robert325 sup taper plan that have helped and inspired so many. One message stood out to me most, "Staying clean of course is the ultimate goal behind my reasoning for sub use. Subs are just a tool to help us get clean. The people who end up STAYING clean would likely have done it with or without the subs. They are just a tool to assist us."

    I whole heartedly believe this statement. I have nothing against ppl who use subpxone for maintenance, when i was 16 shooting H i would of needed this method for anyhopes of long term sobriety, but after a lengthy bout of relapses, treatment centers and AA/NA meetings, the matinence method is just not for me. To all who is going through or planning to make the jump, i cant promise you it will be easy, but i will promise it will be worth it, stay strong and grounded, it will get better before long.
    Beefaroni7272 likes this.

  7. #7
    Beefaroni7272 is offline Advanced Member
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    Hey lay back what cat said is so true. It doesn't matter how or when you count. What matters is what that means to you. Congratulations on making it this far. Today is day 26 that I haven't taken a sub. I was on them for 4.5 years at 16mg/day. Then I tapered myself down to 1mg/day over 6 months. Before that I was taking 240-300 mg of oxy everyday. It has been quite a journey to say the least. For the first 2weeks when I jumped I was terrible. Found this site at day 11 and reading people's threads has really helped me stay the course. Didn't really realize how powerful subs were until then. I thought I tapered down enough. But 1mg is still a hefty dose and i was in for a rough time. I made it though. With the support of everyone here I'm getting better. Still dealing with sleep, depression, fatigue but looking back I'm a lot better than I was 2 weeks ago. Everything is better and it will only get better with time. Every day is a struggle but I'm dealing with it and have no desire to go back. I don't think you're in for as rough a time as me but I sure you got a little longer to go of just feeling "off" the best thing that you can do is just keep a positive outlook and keep reminding yourself of why you are doing this. That has kept me sane over the past two weeks and reading other threads of people's trials and successes that were in the same boat that I was has really helped also. Good luck on your journey. Keep us posted. If only to keep your mind active, it helps. Everyone on this site is with you!! Take it one day at a time.

    Beef

  8. #8
    GiantNY is offline New Member
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    Wow, man after 9 years. That's a great warning to me and others that you're never really safe and always have to keep at it.

    With respect to counting, I started from my last dose but to each their own. That's awesome that you're active i definitely wanna be moreso active. I play soccer only once a week - miss those days when i played 3-4 times a week. Staying active is probably the most important thing in my opinion. Keep at it - you'll feel better faster.
    Hope it's going alright for you man - you can do this.

  9. #9
    LayBak is offline New Member
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    Yea Giant staying active is key. I spent the weekend camping and work has been crazy this week. Headed down south for a week this weekend. Giant, i may be in my early 30's but that soccer takes a toll. Had 3 games last week and i could barely move after it all lol. Felt like i got beat with a bat, could barely get out of bed in the morning. But ill recover from that as well. In active addiction i always had a reason not to show to games, but now im all about going. I wanna start running and working out more, get back in the groove of things.

    So status update, day 10 no sub and almost 30 days no h. Damn thats surreal, i gotta take a sec to let that set in......so im feeling some fatigue, im tired af alot. Sleep is odd, some days i can go 12 hours straight, some days its 2 hours at a time. Until last night, i hadnt need to use the chlonidine or trazadone. Once again the hot flashs and chills are gone but the chlonidine will but me down along with the trazadone.i couldnt sleep well so i decided to take both. Didnt really work, went to bed around 11, woke up at 12 for an hour, took traz and chlonidine then slept till 6am and awoke again for the day. Like i said, it comes in waves, but thats all im dealing with. The cravings are next to nill. I think it has something to do with the anger and guilt of relapse after all that time. No desire to roll thru the hood and see how things are going. Back in the day however, 30 days into recover my mind wasnt rite. I would do drug addict things like driving thru the old hood where my guy lived, i guess now, ovee the past 18 years in and out of addiction and the fact im older, im just greatful i escaped and have no desire to behave like i was a month or 2 ago. Also to all the newcomers, like me, hang in there, im proof it gets better. I wouldnt trade my little issues currently for what i went thru the first couple days i quit using. Dont ever forget what you went through in the start of detox, its nothing like where you are now.
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  10. #10
    Beefaroni7272 is offline Advanced Member
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    Hey layback. Congratulations on day 10. Glad you're feeling better. Sleep and fatigue........ oh those two cruel mistresses. They're killing me right now, my situations a little bit different than yours with me being a long time sub user but I feel you on the no cravings to go back to where we were. I'm on day 32 today and feeling better every day. Everyone says those are the last two things to mellow out. And it takes some time of course but you seem to be moving along very quickly. Good for you. I'm happy that it's not drawing it out for you. And I know that the soccer and staying active helps. For the first 3 weeks I could barely pull myself off the couch or out of bed. Kinda forcing myself to be active now and it's hard but rewarding. I would love to be able to sleep for 12 hours lol. But I'll take 3-4 for right now. I know in a few more weeks I'll be hopefully back to my usual 6-8 hours. (Fingers crossed). I'm so happy for you and keep up the good work and let us know how you're doing. Stay strong, take it slow!!

    Beef
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