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Suboxone withdrawal Daily Diary - need support!
  1. #31
    Rhodesy is offline Member
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    Day 8

    Today my head is a lot clearer and my physical symptoms have not been present really hardly at all. I think my body is finally starting to produce natural amounts of dopamine. I can only hope. Last night I was so tired I almost felt like I was on hallucinogens. I ended up making myself eat a big meal and stayed awake until 10pm. I woke up about 3 hours later wide awake with mild RLS. It was very uncomfortable but nothing like the past few nights. I took some valerian root and melatonin and was surprised that it actually worked. I slept another 6 hours and woke up feeling very tired and groggy. I'm glad I got the sleep though. I really needed it.

    I forced myself to stay busy and to have a pretty intense work out. I took ginseng and a multivitamin and I slowly got some energy throughout the morning. My head started to clear. I was starting to get depressed with all the meaningless things I was doing just to stay busy. After lunch I went for an hour walk and came home and read for a while. Fell asleep reading and woke up around 2. Since then I've been pretty bored quite frankly. My physical symptoms have been at bay all day and I'm starting to think pretty clearly now. Not fully there yet but progressing. Each day it seems like there's something new to be my source of anxiety. I'm trying very hard to keep it one day at a time. I also have basically taken off the past 8 years of my life. I need to create a life for myself. Every one of my friends throughout the years are either addicts or are married and live in another state. I don't really have any family to speak of either. I think I'm in a situation where a lot people aren't where I truly am alone. Trying not to let the feeling of loneliness overwhelm me or hold me hostage. I keep telling myself there are opportunities everywhere to meet people. I'm a bit of an introvert though so it's hard to really put myself out there. I'm going to try though and I'll keep you posted on how it goes. Overall I'd say today was another step in the right direction. It's such a slow process and I have to rebuild so many parts of my life that it feels very daunting though. I'm trying to stay positive though. That's really all I can do at this point. It's still a waiting game to fully get my head back.

  2. #32
    crazyfrog is offline Banned
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    One reason i responded to your thread was due to it sounding like myself. Lots of relations. I myself am a hard introvert. I have a family and don't know how the heck i did that! Lol. I'll tell you that i almost lost the family though, this addiction had made me even more or a introvert. I don't go to family gatherings ay all unless i have to fix something over there and Christmas. Lol. I have 2 solid friends. That's it. Everyone else i just don't like a friends. Everyone is trying to impress everyone or try to use me for my kindness. So i always tend to not make friends unless i really connect. Because of my daughter, i meet a ton of moms that have been actually very nice to me. So even though they don't know it, they have given me more friendship than i grew up with. I'm telling you, im a introvert .lol. i know what you mean, even though you feel better, your mind gets bored still and thoughts creep up that induce depression. That got me hard on day 9. I was hating life even more. But! I told myself that is just another stage. And i just trucked through the day once again. I think 1 to 2 more days and your body symptoms will be gone. But. .. the mind games begin. That's where i am. That's the longest stage that drags forever ! You feel ok body wise but you have slight down and up moods. The down moods induce depression and severe boredom. The up induce plain simple contemp. THAT cycle carries on for days and days. Look at me, day 13 and still don't feel 100% normal. I am laughing more and have way longer contempt periods but depression pops in briefly during the day. But! The good news is it goes away a lot faster. Before day 10, if i got depressed it would last hours! Now its minutes. So you got that coming! Be excited!

    REMEMBER ! GOING BACK TO THE PILLS RESETS THIS WHOLE PROCESS ! So if you like going through this agony, pop more. Otherwise stay on course! It gets better and better!

    Now. ... you are younger than i am. What woyld help you alot is a companion like you stated. Is there any way you can meet girls in your area? Being a introvert I couldn't do this, just go out and meet girls. I just got lucky and my friend introduced me to a family member of his. And then i build a relationship from there. In your case, you might have to try to do it the old fashion way and go out and meet. If you are not up to that, try crsigslist personals. Or any dating site. That's the new way in meeting really. But i think of you kick this habit and meet a girl, OMG the love dopamine and endorphins will over ride the cravings completely and you may in fact stay clean for the test of your life. That's my theory! Lol. I'm serious too. I remember my first love, damn.... its better thsn any drug.

  3. #33
    crazyfrog is offline Banned
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    Btw.. thanks a million Rhodesy! Even just you responding to me has given me how i can quit . You might not realize it but you have helped me tremendously! Sharing this experience is like walking through a scary fantasy world. It starts bad but gets better and better as the story goes on. And at the end of the story, the good guy wins and peace reigns the world. I know.. cheeesy! Hehe

  4. #34
    Rhodesy is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by crazyfrog View Post
    Btw.. thanks a million Rhodesy! Even just you responding to me has given me how i can quit . You might not realize it but you have helped me tremendously! Sharing this experience is like walking through a scary fantasy world. It starts bad but gets better and better as the story goes on. And at the end of the story, the good guy wins and peace reigns the world. I know.. cheeesy! Hehe
    Lol. Thanks man. I appreciate all your feedback and advice. It has helped me more than you know. It's good to know there's someone out there going through a similar journey. And I'm definitely going to take your advice on dating. In due time though. I want to really get my head right. The effects of suboxone withdrawals can last a really long time so I want to make sure I'm in a really good place before I open myself up to a relationship that could turn unhealthy and send me right back to square one. I really long for companionship though so it's hard to keep telling myself to wait. I know it's the right thing to do though.

  5. #35
    crazyfrog is offline Banned
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    Rhodesy, just wait until you meet her ! I thought i would have never marry honestly. Let alone have a baby. But i stuck through it! Became a father and raised a daughter. I never wanted kids. But once she was born, evolution took over. Something clicked in my brain. And i knew i had to be with this little new human and make sure she grows up good. Then all the father things fell in place. And it wasnt bad, I loved the park visits and watching her smile and laugh. When they are between 3 and 5, they are the best! Now she is 15 and i miss those day. Thats one will power reason for me to quit now than later. I started taking pills when she was 7. And time flew with these pills! I dont want to go further and kick myself later in my kater life saying i dont remember anything.

    For you, next chapter should be a career move if you feel your current is a dead end and that girl waiting. Shes out there! Trust me!And I known its hard! You don't have to go back to school. There's plenty of good paying trades. And then once you got a relationship going, its a natural huge high. You wake up and live for her! You want her safe and happy.You want to be with her everyday. Next thing you know, a baby is on the way. That is the life cycle for humans. You can do it Rhodesy, i keep saying if i did... anyone can.

    Well day 13 almost coming to a end. Wish i could speed it up somehow. Like sleep for 2 weeks more. Lol.

  6. #36
    crazyfrog is offline Banned
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    Also, let me warn u about loperamide . If you buy it do NOT get the gel type. Get the regular pill type . The gel pill tend to make your stomach cramp bad! It goes away but its unnecessary pain. The regular ones don't do that. Something in the gel that causes that. It happens to me and other people i talk to online dais the same thing.

  7. #37
    Mixedupguy is offline New Member
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    Hey guys,

    I just read through your thread, Rhodesy and Crazyfrog, you're a good match - should be a TV show. Out of all the threads, your stories are similar to mine, but I never used much more than one maybe one and a half perqs a day and not much at all on the weekends. I'm 48 and was diagnosed with ADD about 8 years ago and I've been dealing with chronic pain for a long time so I guess the perqs I got for a vasectomy (I stretched the complication pain for 6 months) were my way of self medicating for the ADD and pain. I always felt invincible on perqs, they were my magic weapon to crank at work and enjoy life until, well you know how it goes. I'm jumping off soon, but its been years on this >>>> and I'm nervous about the mental side more than physical. The mental part is just cruel on top of physical side. Can you do me a favor and stay in touch.

    Congratulations to you guys! I've become an introvert myself, no excitement to do anything or go out like I used to, I used to love happy hours, barbecues or just hanging with friends and now I avoid it all. Hopefully I can get it all back together soon.

    BTW I was put on 16mg sub when I started, what did I know? They screwed me from the get go. Now on 5mg and hoping to get off asap. Your advice would always be appreciated.

    Peace fellas

    C
    Last edited by Anonymous; 05-14-2015 at 02:43 PM.

  8. #38
    crazyfrog is offline Banned
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mixedupguy View Post
    Hey guys,
    8
    I just read through your thread, Rhodesy and Crazyfrog, you're a good match - should be a TV show. Out of all the threads, your stories are similar to mine, but I never used much more than one maybe one and a half perqs a day and not much at all on the weekends. I'm 48 and was diagnosed with ADD about 8 years ago and I've been dealing with chronic pain for a long time so I guess the perqs I got for a vasectomy (I stretched the complication pain for 6 months) were my way of self medicating for the ADD and pain. I always felt invincible on perqs, they were my magic weapon to crank at work and enjoy life until, well you know how it goes. I'm jumping off soon, but its been years on this >>>> and I'm nervous about the mental side more than physical. The mental part is just cruel on top of physical side. Can you do me a favor and stay in touch.

    Congratulations to you guys! I've become an introvert myself, no excitement to do anything or go out like I used to, I used to love happy hours, barbecues or just hanging with friends and now I avoid it all. Hopefully I can get it all back together soon.

    BTW I was put on 16mg sub when I started, what did I know? They screwed me from the get go. Now on 5mg and hoping to get off asap. Your advice would always be appreciated.

    Peace fellas

    C
    A tv show! Imagine that, I'll have a panic attack due to the cameras on me. Lol. I'm not out the woods yet unfortunately, some doom and gloom set in about 2 hours ago but it left already. Had lunch and Feel better. I Notice that if you starve because you have no oambitions, it makes all this harder to deal with.

    When you quit, go ahead post here. It helps a lot to talk about it. And if you quit, quiting everything is the fastest recovery. Cold turkey is my only way for me.

  9. #39
    crazyfrog is offline Banned
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    Mixedupguy, i kinda was similar. Low dosage on the last year. Highest i did was in the begining. I was taking 25mg hydro every 4 hours three times a day. Did that for almost 6 years. Took it for all big Activia during the day. Helped me be social and have be a great amount of confidence. Then my supply got cut in half. So i fell to 10-15 mg every 4 hours. Still worked good for me. Gave new the rush opiates give. Ohh how much i miss it! Lol. Then starting this year the doc was like, time to get off! Ib was like "eff! What! I need them! What will i do! How will i live! " finally i managed to go another 5 months at 10mg two or three times a day. Then the doc finally said last refill and no more. Well here i am. Lolol. Sucks! But i need to make this work. I'm stalled in life. No progress. Wife getting real tired. Although she don't know, it's my erratic attitude that causes problems. Never was like this. So. .. i want to upgrade my PC, get a new car and get back to being a good partner. Only way is to stop chasing these pills! Costing me almost 300$ a month for doc visit and refills! I just can't do this no more. So being in this time frame, i just jumped and holding on tight ! Hehe... tomorrow is the longest Ive gone without any aid like Kratom in which sent me to the ER. So its a landmark for me. Again. . I have a very addictive personality, so if i can do this. ...so can you.

  10. #40
    Rhodesy is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mixedupguy View Post
    Hey guys,

    I just read through your thread, Rhodesy and Crazyfrog, you're a good match - should be a TV show. Out of all the threads, your stories are similar to mine, but I never used much more than one maybe one and a half perqs a day and not much at all on the weekends. I'm 48 and was diagnosed with ADD about 8 years ago and I've been dealing with chronic pain for a long time so I guess the perqs I got for a vasectomy (I stretched the complication pain for 6 months) were my way of self medicating for the ADD and pain. I always felt invincible on perqs, they were my magic weapon to crank at work and enjoy life until, well you know how it goes. I'm jumping off soon, but its been years on this >>>> and I'm nervous about the mental side more than physical. The mental part is just cruel on top of physical side. Can you do me a favor and stay in touch.

    Congratulations to you guys! I've become an introvert myself, no excitement to do anything or go out like I used to, I used to love happy hours, barbecues or just hanging with friends and now I avoid it all. Hopefully I can get it all back together soon.

    BTW I was put on 16mg sub when I started, what did I know? They screwed me from the get go. Now on 5mg and hoping to get off asap. Your advice would always be appreciated.

    Peace fellas

    C
    Hey, thanks for sharing your story. Make sure to keep in touch. I'll keep this thread updated daily. My biggest advice to you is to not stay on suboxone too long. The longer you're on it the harder it is to come off. However, I would stay on it until your desire to do pills goes away. I know right now it feels like you'll crave perks forever but suboxone has a weird way of erasing those cravings from your mind. It's one of the major positives of the drug. The more you stay on it though the more it changes you as a person. Make sure you have people to talk to you. Go to meetings, talk with a local pastor, etc. I stayed on suboxone for way too long and it's really affected my life in a negative way. Stay strong! A better and more meaningful life is waiting for you.

  11. #41
    Rhodesy is offline Member
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    Day 9

    Today has been a frustrating day. I did get relatively good sleep last night (without the aid of anything but a hot shower). About 6 hours straight. Once I got up and had breakfast, vitamins, etc. I still felt very groggy. I made myself move around and figured it would go away but it didn't. It actually got worse. I start to feel exhausted. I decided to go for a long walk around noon. I walked for about 2 hours and when I got back home I was so exhausted I couldn't even keep my eyes open. I fell asleep for about an hour and got up. I finally was able to shake the exhaustion but then immediately the loneliness and feelings of hopelessness started to set in. I have a complex set of emotions that are sucking the life out of me. I would describe it as a feeling of cabin fever mixed with extreme loneliness mixed with feelings of hopelessness. It's very hard to even be content doing something. I'm trying very hard to enjoy a show or enjoy a meal and it's just not there. The only times I have been content is right after my nightly hot shower and during my walks in the sun. The sun definitely helps a lot.

    I hope I'm not discouraging anyone from quitting by being so negative. I'm just being honest and giving accurate descriptions of what has gone on in my day. The past 9 days have been some of the hardest of my life. WAY WAY harder than I thought it was going to be. I am praying a lot and trying to think of ways to get my mindset in a better place. I'm really hoping things start improving in the next couple of days. I will say though that I have seen progress every single day. It's just that It's such a slow progression and the point I started at was the lowest of the low. My physical symptoms have improved with each day. My RLS still flares up but goes away usually within an hour. My concentration and focus has slowly improved but is still not even close to where I'm hoping it will be. The mental struggle is always present and seems to have a new twist each day. I'm praying that happiness and even contentment is coming for me. And for that matter coming soon.

  12. #42
    crazyfrog is offline Banned
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    Excellent update! But yeah, looks like the mental part is hitting hard. Dame thing happen to me on day 8 to 20. Hopelessness! Alone in this stage world. Completely understand. But day 9 clean! That's a accomplishment! It will only get better! If you stay on track, by next week this time you will feel so much better!

  13. #43
    crazyfrog is offline Banned
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    Rhodesy.... if you read back i think i prayed in this thread or it could have been a different one. But i stayed that i had a very hard time on the 10th day. I have severe cravings with bad depression in the morning. It came out of no where! Lasted 2 hours and then i leveled ok. So im not surprised you had a bad day. But now you will notice a pattern. You will have ups and downs pretty evenly. Now. . >> you can go 2 more days with absolutely no relapse, the ups will begin to dominate the downs. That's exactly what i noticed with me on day 11 to 13. So don't give up!

    And holy sh+t! I did a mile jog today after work and wow, it helped! I feel achy on my legs but my mind is actually the best is been since the start. Almost like the natural rush i have been waiting. This might be it!

  14. #44
    Rhodesy is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by crazyfrog View Post
    Rhodesy.... if you read back i think i prayed in this thread or it could have been a different one. But i stayed that i had a very hard time on the 10th day. I have severe cravings with bad depression in the morning. It came out of no where! Lasted 2 hours and then i leveled ok. So im not surprised you had a bad day. But now you will notice a pattern. You will have ups and downs pretty evenly. Now. . >> you can go 2 more days with absolutely no relapse, the ups will begin to dominate the downs. That's exactly what i noticed with me on day 11 to 13. So don't give up!

    And holy sh+t! I did a mile jog today after work and wow, it helped! I feel achy on my legs but my mind is actually the best is been since the start. Almost like the natural rush i have been waiting. This might be it!
    Great news! Keep it up! The jogging and walking for me help a ton. Even when you really don't feel like doing it you feel so much better afterwards.
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  15. #45
    crazyfrog is offline Banned
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhodesy View Post
    Great news! Keep it up! The jogging and walking for me help a ton. Even when you really don't feel like doing it you feel so much better afterwards.
    Hey Rhodesy , sorry on my last 2 past. Didn't proof read. Typos everywhere. Well, i got my first natural real happy rush yesterday after the jog. Was waiting for it since day 10. I knew it was close, but didn't know when. But anyways, just to document it for others. 8 hours into Day 14 was my first real happy moment. It was nice, lasted about 2 hours. Then i was just ok. So these should come from now on, the space between them gets shorter and shorter. Long process.

    Now, it's the waiting game for the cravings to completely go away. I remember when i went cold turkey years ago. I lasted 12 days but i was just waiting for doctor to come through with the refill. But i clearly recall being happier and not caring no more for being the refill. Cravings were completely gone. I was even thinking of canceling the refill request. But i was younger and still wanted to party. So let's see when i hit that stage. Im estimating another week minimum.

    Update your daily status for the day Rhodesy! Curious where you are mentally. I'm guessing you will have a easier day today mentally compared to yesterday. The body symptoms should be easier than before aswell. Let's us know.
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  16. #46
    Rhodesy is offline Member
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    Day 10

    Today was a lot better than any day I've had so far. Far from where I hope to be soon but it really was a step in the right direction. I was able to enjoy the little things. It started last night. I still had mild RLS but for some reason when the sun went down I was able to just watch some shows on Netflix and actually enjoy them. Kind of lose myself in them for the first time since this process started. I was so exhausted that I crashed at about midnight. I woke up about 5 hours later I'd say and laid there for a while with RLS.

    When i finally got up and ate breakfast I was surprised that I could shake off the cobwebs. My head felt clearer than it's been since this thing started. I read a little bit and kept myself busy. At around noon I went for a jog and was gone for about two hours. It was quite a work out but it felt so good. The sun beating down on me and the smell of fresh grass. It was nice. I reached out to some loved ones when I got back and it was nice to talk to somebody. I don't have a close relationship with anyone but family is still family. They still care about you. Anybody else who's feeling lonely I would urge to force yourself to reach out to people. It's hard at first but it really works.

    By the time I got off the phone it was probably around 4 and I laid down for a bit because I was exhausted. Got up about an hour later and felt a little more refreshed. I'll be happy when I can get a good night's sleep but it's a process. An interminably slow process at times. I can honestly say that each day has been an improvement on the last though. Eating healthy and getting exercise has really helped me a lot. That and prayer. LOTS of prayer. For all the agnostics out there reading this and having a really difficult time I would urge you to pray. It's therapeutic and really has lifted my spirits at my lowest points. For all the desperate and hopeless addicts on day 5 or 6 of your withdrawal hang in there. It does get better. I'm only on day 10 and I'm not out of the woods by any stretch, but I genuinely feel a little better every day. Remember this is a fight to get YOU back. To have a life where your present. I'll update again tomorrow. God bless.
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  17. #47
    Rhodesy is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by crazyfrog View Post
    Hey Rhodesy , sorry on my last 2 past. Didn't proof read. Typos everywhere. Well, i got my first natural real happy rush yesterday after the jog. Was waiting for it since day 10. I knew it was close, but didn't know when. But anyways, just to document it for others. 8 hours into Day 14 was my first real happy moment. It was nice, lasted about 2 hours. Then i was just ok. So these should come from now on, the space between them gets shorter and shorter. Long process.

    Now, it's the waiting game for the cravings to completely go away. I remember when i went cold turkey years ago. I lasted 12 days but i was just waiting for doctor to come through with the refill. But i clearly recall being happier and not caring no more for being the refill. Cravings were completely gone. I was even thinking of canceling the refill request. But i was younger and still wanted to party. So let's see when i hit that stage. Im estimating another week minimum.

    Update your daily status for the day Rhodesy! Curious where you are mentally. I'm guessing you will have a easier day today mentally compared to yesterday. The body symptoms should be easier than before aswell. Let's us know.

    That's great news man! I'm happy for you. Addiction is a hard thing to live with but life sober is a lot more enjoyable. I hope you keep progressing. Don't give up. And you were right, I did feel a lot better today. Hopefully tomorrow we'll both feel even better!
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  18. #48
    crazyfrog is offline Banned
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhodesy View Post
    That's great news man! I'm happy for you. Addiction is a hard thing to live with but life sober is a lot more enjoyable. I hope you keep progressing. Don't give up. And you were right, I did feel a lot better today. Hopefully tomorrow we'll both feel even better!
    Ok. Read your day 10. Yup... you are improving! But carefully. ... i got nasty waves of depression on day 11. Just bare through it. And totally agree on the exercise. At this later stage in wd, it works! And totally agree about the sun. It feels soo good on the skin. Its warmth is like a blessing. Odd! And the smells of nature. .. soo inviting! Rhodesy , looks like you are trucking through! And committed! Hahaha! That's awesome! I got good news for you. Yesterday's natural high did something to my brain, like it kick started something. Hard to explain but here's what i mean. .....

    today I didn't get a good hard natural high, but i was contempt through most of the day. But after lunch, thoughts creeped in and i remembered the pills and the high it gave me. But for the first time it didn't have much of a effect to my mentality. Almost like I'm being to not care if i don't take them no more. It was a slight change of thought process. Normally I'll get bummed out when I recall the good high I got from the pills. But today. .. it was like I almost cared a little less. I was surprised after I realized how i reacted. My guess is my brain is leveling out to fully normal levels and the endorphins are finally almost beyon halfway there. So day 15 for me was actually another big change in this process. So >> be happy if I was you Rhodesy, you'll understand me better when you hit this stage.
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  19. #49
    Iluv2smile is offline Platinum Member
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    U You guys are doing great!
    I have been working the last 2 days so I just work
    3 days a week
    But 12 hrs a day..
    For those 3 days all i do is work..
    1 more day!


    My world became so small in my addiction..
    I would work my 3 days..
    Then the other 4 just isolate!
    Awful
    Lonely
    Sad..
    Since I got clean ..
    I have forced myself to meet others..
    I am single too but have 2 children
    And 2 granddaughters..
    I spent a lot of time now with the one that lives near me!!
    It brings so much joy..

    I finally realized when I got clean last year
    That I was missing so much not
    Only in my life
    But in my family's life..

    Now like you !
    We can go out and get those endorphins flowing from healthy things..
    I am happy you both are here for each other..
    One addict helping another is really the only way we get clean..
    The secret to staying clean!
    I finally fiquered it out..!

    To Share our experience
    Strength
    And hope
    With other addicts who are still suffering..
    We are so fortunate to be clean!
    Many addicts never get 1 day clean..
    Let alone 2 or 3 weeks..
    I celebrate my year from methadone on Tuesday...
    This is been the best year in lots of years..
    I am to share it !

    Thank you for sharing yours!
    Take care
    Bette
    Last edited by Anonymous; 05-15-2015 at 10:55 PM.
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  20. #50
    Rhodesy is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iluv2smile View Post
    U You guys are doing great!
    I have been working the last 2 days so I just work
    3 days a week
    But 12 hrs a day..
    For those 3 days all i do is work..
    1 more day!


    My world became so small in my addiction..
    I would work my 3 days..
    Then the other 4 just isolate!
    Awful
    Lonely
    Sad..
    Since I got clean ..
    I have forced myself to meet others..
    I am single too but have 2 children
    And 2 granddaughters..
    I spent a lot of time now with the one that lives near me!!
    It brings so much joy..

    I finally realized when I got clean last year
    That I was missing so much not
    Only in my life
    But in my family's life..

    Now like you !
    We can go out and get those endorphins flowing from healthy things..
    I am happy you both are here for each other..
    One addict helping another is really the only way we get clean..
    The secret to staying clean!
    I finally fiquered it out..!

    To Share our experience
    Strength
    And hope
    With other addicts who are still suffering..
    We are so fortunate to be clean!
    Many addicts never get 1 day clean..
    Let alone 2 or 3 weeks..
    I celebrate my year from methadone on Tuesday...
    This is been the best year in lots of years..
    I am to share it !

    Thank you for sharing yours!
    Take care
    Bette
    Thanks for sharing your experience. It really is quite a process but you're right, hearing from other addicts throughout their various stages has helped me tremendously. I wish you all the best and hope things continue to go well for you. I have a lot of work to do to have continued progression but know it's worth the fight to have a fulfilling life. I know that it just never would've happened while on suboxone. Suboxone really changed me in so many ways. When you're on it you barely notice it too or chalk it up to you getting older and changing as a person. I became much more socially awkward and unwilling to put myself out there while on suboxone. I wasn't comfortable with who I was. I'm starting to get that back, thank God. If you want to have meaningful relationships you have to get clean. And for me personally, after almost 8 years of being a solitary individual I want nothing more than to have meaningful relationships, be that family friends, etc. Life is hard but it can also be incredibly rewarding. Using makes it so much harder and robs you of those rewards.

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    Love2smile... so true. Realizing is possible to get off. Day 16 for me. Feel good today. I'm update later. Rhodesy . .. keep going!

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    Day 11

    Another day, another step towards clarity. Today started off not great as I woke up with a splitting headache. I had fallen asleep last night at midnight and woke up wide awake about an hour later. I decided to take melatonin and valerian root and it did allow me to fall back asleep and sleep for another 6 hours or so. I woke up extremely groggy and tired though with a massive headache. One of those that are actually painful. I took two aleve once I got moving around though and the headache and grogginess dissipated rather quickly.

    I was in relatively good spirits after eating breakfast and having tea but felt pretty lazy for some reason. It was raining outside too which made it worse. I forced myself to work out though and was glad I did. In the afternoon I watched some tv and read for a bit. The RLS seems to be going away more and more every day. Last night I did have a period of about 2 hours where it was very uncomfortable and had it a little bit throughout the night, but it's genuinely getting better each day. I hope that my physical symptoms stop entirely soon so I can focus solely on getting my mind right. At least every day I am making some progress. Whether that progress is small or large it's still progress. I try to to take comfort in that. My head felt a little more clearer today. I am slowly getting back to my normal self. I know my brain still has a ways to go though. 8 years of suboxone use really took a toll on my brain and it's going to take a long time for it to heal but each day has been an improvement on the last. I know I keep saying that but I think it's important to celebrate that sobriety is an ascension. You're constantly growing and moving forward. Like life, I don't think sobriety is always a straight line but it certainly is always progressing and moving in the right direction. What you put into it is what you get out of it. Hopefully I'll feel even better tomorrow than I did today. If so then I think I'm on my way to happiness and getting myself back.

  23. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by crazyfrog View Post
    Love2smile... so true. Realizing is possible to get off. Day 16 for me. Feel good today. I'm update later. Rhodesy . .. keep going!

    Keep me updated on the progress! Glad to hear you're doing well.

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    Well... its after noon . Won't lie, had a lonely depressed few hours. Has to be paws. Hit me around 12pm and ended around 4pm. Came out of nowhere. I stayed home alone so i think that was it. Not a good day but I'm feeling better now.

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    Doing better this late afternoon.

  26. #56
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    This part was amazing! Rhodesy read this. This should make you want to stay clean now! Linking to other sites is forbidden i think so i copy and paste. A guy named Ruchard posted.


    Many people addicted to oxys, hydro,>>>>>>>, fentayl, or other>opiatesare concerned about what to expect AFTER the initial>WITHDRAWALperiod (~3-10 days, depends on the>drug).

    The reality of Recovering from>Opiate>addiction is that there is an initial "HELL" period (immediate withdrawal) that is followed by a much longer, much milder period of time while the body is fine-tuning the nervous system, and while the body's own endogenous opiate system (endorphin) is recuperating.

    There are 2 basic stages of opiate withdrawal.
    The Short-lived, Acute, intense, immediate withdrawal which occurs directly after stopping all opiates. "clucking", shakes, profuse sweating, chills, gooseflesh, body temperature instability, autonomic instability, "revved-up," diarrhea, cramping, bone pain, mental anguish, etc. (takes ~3 to 10 days depending on the>half-life>of the drug)
    PAWS>or "Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome." This is the more drawn-out phase of withdrawal...as the body learns to cope without the>drugs. includes boredom, insomnia, self-doubt, 'restless legs,' depression.

    I believe from my own experience, combined with reports from recovering opiate addicts and the physiology involved that the initial withdrawal is the big, feared MONSTER associated with feelings of sickness and delirium, whereas PAWS can be extremely different for different people. PAWS seems to be more akin to a "waiting game" with fears of overwhelming boredom than an acute sickness. The most important thing to remember during PAWS isAWARENESS that>PAWS IS ONLY TEMPORARY!

    With time, PAWS will go away!! In fact, with few exceptions, it seems that with every passing week, PAWS symptoms can be demonstrated as improving--sometimes DRAMATICALLY compared to the weeks prior.

    Some Reasons why PAWS takes several months to get over:
    Behavioral changes are necessary in order to learn new and solid pathways for the brain's reward circuit, andIt takes MUCH LONGER for your effectiveneurotransmitter>levels and nerve conduction parameters to return to normal, pre-addiction>levels.
    And depending on your expectations and how you approach these critical 're-building' and 're-organizing' phases, will go far in how well you'll feel during and after withdrawal.


    What can be done to HELP your nerve conduction while re-equilibrating to life without opiates?>(or--"How to Maximize Your Neuronal Signaling During Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome.")
    Boost the deficient neurotransmitters.Maximize electrical conduction ALONG the nerve.
    1. BOOSTING THE DEFICIENT NEUROTRANSMITTERS.>
    First, let's talk about boosting the neurotransmitters. For the opiate addict, this means SPECIFICALLY "ENDORPHIN"---short for "Endogenously Produced MorphineEndomorphineENDORPHIN."

    There are some things you should know about endorphins. They are the body's natural opiate. Endorphin is released naturally in response to pain, orgasm, exercise, laughter, positive thoughts, secondary messengers responsible for fevers & immune responses, and there are other potential triggers including prayer.

    These tips>may not seem like earth-shattering phenomena by themselves, but believe me, when these steps are clustered and performed regularly, THEY REALLY DO HELP!!!>

    Common activities known to boost endorphin levels/satisfy cravings:>
    Chocolate.>Chocolate has a mild effect on endorphins.
    Candy. Actually>any>kind of sugary candy boosts natural endorphin levels. Candy helps most with early stages of withdrawal.>Lab mice experiments have shown sugary>sweets>appease craving after abruptly cessation of>morphine.>Swim>practically LIVED on Reese's Pieces, sour candies, M&M's, and those 'tiny' Hershey Kisses for>8 TO 10 WEEKS!>Note: he did>notgain or lose weight during this time.Exercise. This is #1. Force yourself to walk out the front door. FORCE YOURSELF to walk 2-3 blocks from your front door…then you turn around and get 2-3 additional blocks in for good measure. I CANNOT STRESS THIS ENOUGH!!! The best exercise is running/jogging/spinning/anything aerobic. Second best is walking or yoga. Somewhere in-between the two is weight lifting. Weight lifting or resistance-training can be done in a fraction of the time and there is evidence to show that this kind of exercise might benefit the MOST at the late stages of withdrawal (i.e. insomnia from 'restless legs').>

    Quote:

    some medical professionals believe the positive feeling you get>when you meet a physical challenge,>rather than the exertion itself, is what stimulates the endorphin release....(how much endorphin-release you get) is all about>intensity>and>duration.

    *
    Accomplishment. That's right. Any kind of accomplishments. Small ones, big ones. Just be sure you're PLANNING and EXECUTING daily. Anything that fosters a feeling of self-accomplishment and PRIDE will cause your brain to squirt out some Endogenous Morphine.Sex. Orgasms release endorphins. You've probably already figured this one out… OR--more likely, you've noticed that your sex drive has gone down to almost NOTHING while on opiates. This is normal. I can explain the hormones of it later if you're interested. The point is, you've replaced the endorphin-rush of sex with one that requires no build-up, no mess, and no chance of rejection. Do not feel embarrassed if you become a masturbation machine. This is also a normal part of recovery. Eventually, the sex act itself will be overshadowed by the LOVE aspect.Love. Love is a complicated emotion. It's the fuel for poets, playwrights since recorded history and the need for it traces all the way back to the first man and woman. HOWEVER!! SEXUAL LOVE IS *NOT* WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT HERE!!!! Ultimately, your most long-lasting, gratifying experiences outside of drugs will come from the experience of giving AND RECEIVING love. Get creative with this. Love your enemies. Remember people's names. Start remembering birthdays. Surprise someone with your generosity. Next time you mow the lawn, cut your neighbor's grass…and take his trash out to the street.Donate>time to feeding the homeless. There's literally TENS OF THOUSANDS of small things you can do to put forth love out into the world. *THIS* is the true secret to learning how to live without opiates! And believe it or not, the rewards are MUCH GREATER than even the best >>>>>> you'll ever do!!! But you've got to get up and DO SOMETHING!Sleep. Eventually---like in 4-6 months from now--your body's autonomic nervous system will stop being 'revved-up' all the time. Eventually, you will be able to sleep again without having to knock yourself in the head with a sledgehammer! When this day comes, BE PREPARED! Start going to bed as early as possible, to allow yourself a good 7 or 8 hours of restful sleep. Your endorphin levels will naturally increase from the circadian rhythm, plus you'll allow yourself the luxury of copious dreaming--not only endorphin-releasing, but overall will make your days more relaxing and give your psyche plenty of time to play.Eat a hot Chili Pepper.>*

    Quote:

    The rush you get after holding one on your tongue is likely due to your body's protective response. "Chewing a hot pepper can release endorphins centrally and on the tongue," says Dr. Hirsch. Why? To reduce pain, of course.

    Think Positive Thoughts.* Placebos, prayer and positive thinking all trigger endorphin release according to Dr. Slotnick.Get Emotionally Moved *

    Quote:

    Dr. Fuhrman says that viewing beautiful art, watching a touching dramatic scene or even listening to an inspiring piece of music can produce endorphins. "A person who gets pleasure in life, from whatever source, will keep endorphins at a healthy level," he says.

    Undergo Acupuncture.*

    Quote:

    "Putting needles into the body is a release," says Dr. Fuhrman, "and it may trigger endorphin production." Also, acupuncture patients benefit from a>placebo>effect -- they believe that the process is working, so it really does, says Dr. Fuhrman. Talk about the brain's power.
    Endorphin factor: 3 (NOTE: HIGHEST LEVEL). People who use acupuncture tend to be positive thinkers, which adds to the effects.

    Be Afraid.*

    Quote:

    Whether you're watching a horror movie... or feeling a rush of wind in your hair as you plummet down a steep incline on a roller coaster,fear causes endorphin release.>Why do you think extreme sports are so popular? No one>wants>to get hurt; it's just fun (in a twisted kind of way) to cheat death. "The thrill of a high-speed ride induces a positive mood state that can leave you giddy," says Dr. Hirsch. And Freddy Krueger can do it for you too. Who knew he was such a heartthrob?

    Watch a Funny Movie or TV Show.>More specifically, research has proven that simply the>expectation>of watching one's favorite funny movie releases Beta-endorphin and human growth hormone.** Go ahead and>buy the Seinfeld Box DVD.
    2. MAXIMIZING NERVE CONDUCTION. or>How to Increase Electrical Conductivity WITHIN Neurons.>

    The portion of your body that is re-learning its own equilibrium WITHOUT OPIATES is essentially anaquatic salt-water ecosystem>that runs almost entirely off electrolytes (+ and - particles called "ions" dissolved in solution) and VERY THIN membranes. These membranes are "semi-permeable" which means that with some assistance from various proteins, these membranes allow your body to separate and partition off>positively-charged>& negatively-charged>ions. This creates VOLTAGE--the difference in charges across a membrane or "potential energy.">

    You can imagine the separated + and - ions as being like a battery. As long as the membranes are intact and your body is able to separate positives from negatives, then your batteries are "charged." But, if you punch a hole in one of the membranes or stop actively separating out positives from negatives, you end up with a lifeless or DEAD battery. ions from>

    Anytime you 'fire' off a neuron, an "ON" signal is propagated from somewhere deep inside the brain, along a LOOOONG axon, that ends by terminating into either another neuron (inside the brain) or somewhere else outside the brain (like a muscle or a salivary gland, for example).>

  27. #57
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    CONTINUES. .................


    Watch a Funny Movie or TV Show.>More specifically, research has proven that simply the>expectation>of watching one's favorite funny movie releases Beta-endorphin and human growth hormone.** Go ahead and>buy the Seinfeld Box DVD.
    2. MAXIMIZING NERVE CONDUCTION. or>How to Increase Electrical Conductivity WITHIN Neurons.>

    The portion of your body that is re-learning its own equilibrium WITHOUT OPIATES is essentially anaquatic salt-water ecosystem>that runs almost entirely off electrolytes (+ and - particles called "ions" dissolved in solution) and VERY THIN membranes. These membranes are "semi-permeable" which means that with some assistance from various proteins, these membranes allow your body to separate and partition off>positively-charged>& negatively-charged>ions. This creates VOLTAGE--the difference in charges across a membrane or "potential energy.">

    You can imagine the separated + and - ions as being like a battery. As long as the membranes are intact and your body is able to separate positives from negatives, then your batteries are "charged." But, if you punch a hole in one of the membranes or stop actively separating out positives from negatives, you end up with a lifeless or DEAD battery. ions from>

    Anytime you 'fire' off a neuron, an "ON" signal is propagated from somewhere deep inside the brain, along a LOOOONG axon, that ends by terminating into either another neuron (inside the brain) or somewhere else outside the brain (like a muscle or a salivary gland, for example).>


    If you were to tell yourself, "I am now Lifting my right fore-finger," then a neuron in your brain's motor cortex will first "fire" using a neurotransmitter. But the signal actually travels all the way down on a single neuron from the brain to your right arm. All the way down a discrete "wire" found in a bundle of other wires (your spinal cord) until the single nerve cell finally ends on muscles in your forearm where ANOTHER neurotransmitter is released, cause you to LIFT YOUR RIGHT FOREFINGER.

    Why the description?>well, the FIRST step involved in this example involves a neurotransmitter. In this case, the neurotransmitter is called acetyl-choline... but there are plenty of other neurotransmitters whose functions are to transmit various ideas, emotions, reactions, reflexes, memories, etc.

    The SPECIFIC neurotransmitter you're missing isENDORPHIN. Earlier in this post, I listed suggestions to help you SHOWER your brain with endorphin--and>these>will>make you feel much better.>If you can assimilate some or all of these activities into your daily routine, then you'll not only be back to normal very soon, BUT (swear to GOD)>you'll actually FEEL MUCH BETTER THAN YOU DID ON OPIATES!!!

    The reason I went thru the whole explanation of the + and - ions, the function of cell membranes to partition off these charged particles, and how that nerves & thus your entire brain FUNCTIONS by using a continuous flow of ions in and out of various partitions is because I want you to really REALLY UNDERSTAND something about how our bodies work.

    You see, all this fine detail about nerve transmission can ONLY take place under ONE condition. And this is one of the>most convincing arguments for>>that I've ever heard…>The ONLY PERFECT ENVIRONMENT for the proper flow of electricity and nerve conduction is found---

    Fortunately, our body's have a "waxy coat" of skin that traps the ocean INSIDE US!

    So, whenever you hear someone say "SALT IS BAD FOR YOU", you can tell them they would be DEAD if it weren't for the salt they eat!

    Without getting too involved in this, just know that your body has exquisite mechanisms for hanging onto precious minerals and filtering out 'excess' ions. This is mostly done by the kidneys.HOWEVER, your body has NO WAY of either DILUTING or CREATING electrolytes.>(i.e. sodium, potassium, calcium, magnesium, & trace mineralsSo, HOW CAN YOU ASSIST YOUR BODY IN ACHIEVING THIS OPTIMUM AQUEOUS ENVIRONMENT???>

    Simple.>Drink plenty of water.>Plain>water.>Not colas, not>coffee, not beer.>Your body will utilize pure water to form the MOST PERFECT, EXACT ion levels in the various partitioned areas. Unlike what many people believe, drinking extra water does NOT go straight into your piss!! Rather, the water goes from your GI tract, into your bloodstream where it is then dispersed EVENLY throughout every single cell in your body!>

    That's right…when you drink a glass of pure water, that water becomes almost instantly available to EACH AND EVERY CELL IN YOUR BODY, in order beginning with those cells which NEED WATER THE MOST! So, those cells which urgently need this pure water will get 'first dibs', and so on until the water has been evenly dispersed.>

    What do the cells DO WITH this pure water??>
    Rejuvenate Cell Processes/Restore Cellular Health.>First off, the new water allows overly-concentrated, sluggish, toxic (dehydrated) cells to return to their original healthy size, shape, & texture. You may recall from biology that a single water (H2O) molecule is generated in cellular energy generation (called respiration). Glucose and Oxygen are transformed into energy, releasing CO2, and H2O. Well, if your teachers were like mine,>they neglected to teach how important pre-EXISTING H2O was for this energy to be produced in the first place! Without a surplus of pure H2O, NONE of this energy can be produced!!Eliminate Toxins.>This pure water is necessary for your muscles (and other cells) to mobilize their toxic byproducts for excretion in to the urine.>Plus, the additional water will optimize>sub-cellular activities that have become erratic or sub-optimal from dehydration, built-up waste materials, and are living in an overall unbalanced, unhealthy state. These molecular-level processes will be cleansed by way of excessive hydration, dilution of toxins, and toxic elimination when these toxins are absorbed along with excess water into the bloodstream and almost immediately filtered into the urine. This 'flooding' leads to a "clean slate" on a sub-cellular level, which then allows the cell's energy production to normalize, which translates into higher energy, more energy efficiency on the tissue & organ level which affects the energy and health that we "FEEL" as organisms!!Enhance Normal Nerve Conduction Velocity.Remember all that talk about positive and negative ions being separated by membranes to form a 'biological battery'?? Well, one of the most vitally important pieces of the nerve-conduction puzzle is adequate hydration! Adequate hydration allows nerves to conduct their signals FASTER and also allows each nerve to 'reset itself' FASTER as well! So, in essence,>adding pure water into your body will make your brain and muscles faster and more efficient--as though your neurotransmitter levels were actually HIGHER--when in reality, you haven't done>anything>to change your neurotransmitter levels!When your urine has any yellow>coloration>, this signifies waste products and toxins that your body must ELIMINATE in order to create this perfect aqueous environment for your nerve cells, muscles, and every tissue.

    HOW MUCH WATER SHOULD YOU DRINK?honestly, everyone is different. People going through drug withdrawal require>more water>than someone whose tissues are already in equilibrium. Your need for 'extra' water during times of stress or drug detoxification will be obvious by the color and smell of your urine.>

    RULE OF THUMB REGARDING PURE WATER CONSUMPTION:>Your urine should be>clear>and have>no smell.>This signifies optimal hydration.

    Vitamins and Minerals.>For fastest re-equalization, you should>take ONE daily vitamin>with minerals. These days, most every daily vitamin includesminerals>>folate (aka folic acid).>Don't waste your money on expensive vitamins or supplements. All you need are the basic RDA. The *REAL* secret to maximizing the absorption of vitamins is to simply take them WITH FOOD. Taking excess or "mega-dose" vitamins is just a waste of vitamins.>250mg to 500mg of Vitamin C per day>is also encouraged, especially in the first few months of withdrawal.

    The basic message is to take care of the things that you probably never even THOUGHT ABOUT while on the junk. Things like making sure to take vitamins, eat balanced meals to provide sustenance, exercising and drinking PLENTY OF WATER!

    There are other threads which discuss supplements which can be taken to boost other neurotransmitters like norepinephrine,dopamine, and>serotonin. Feel free to ask me if you have any questions...this is just WAY TOO HUGE of a topic to answer in a single post! good luck future smack quitters, and to all the Ex-Junkies--PEACE!>
    Last edited by Anonymous; 05-16-2015 at 10:10 PM.

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    crazyfrog, wow great post. All relevant information and leads one to believe there is a light at the end of the tunnel. I am continuing to progress each day. It's a long slow ride but I'm getting there. The things that were mentioned in your post have really kept me from being severely depressed. Vigorous exercise, good meals, setting both short and long term goals, etc. Glad that you came out of your funk yesterday. Make sure to stay busy. I'll post how my day went later. Keep up the fight!

  29. #59
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    Day 12

    Last night I binge watched one of my favorite shows on Netflix and enjoyed myself for the most part. I started to get RLS at around 9pm and it was really uncomfortable at first and ramped up in severity throughout the night. It did go away though and I fell asleep a little after midnight. I woke up at around 6 and felt pretty good despite being tired. I got up, ate breakfast and kept myself busy.

    At around noon I went for a jog. when I got back I decided to mow the lawn which took another hour and a half or so. Felt quite tired afterward but was happy I was able to sweat and get that much exercise. As has been my pattern so far, I feel slightly better today than I did yesterday. I'm continuing to progress. It's been such a long road that I just want it to be over so I can feel completely normal again but I know it's a process and you've got to have patience. I'm finally starting to be able to enjoy the little things albeit in very small doses. That's a huge step from where I was even a few days ago though. I am starting to be able to see what my life can be like sober. There's so many great aspects of life. A lot of them you can still experience while on suboxone. A lot of them you can't though. Ans I don't want to settle for even half of life's greatest joys and comforts. I want to be blessed with as many as God allows. I was never myself on suboxone either. I never struck up a conversation with somebody and even if I did it was usually short and unsatisfying. I know this is not everybody's experience with suboxone. I'm just laying out what happened to me. My experiences while on the medication for 8 years. If your story is anything like mine you should think long and hard about quitting. If you want fulfilling and meaningful relationships it really has to be done. I'm so glad I made the choice. At times it will feel like torture. Like you're not even yourself. But each day will be slightly better than the last and before you know it you'll suddenly be fully present and back to being YOU.

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    AWow! Day 12 for you! Good job Rhodesy. 12th day is always a turning point for me. I'm glad it was some what for you too! Looks like your mind is beginning to level itself slowly! If you are having slight happiness , then you have made it! It's the begining of finding your old self again. Its sloow! But time is the only cur. Yesterday i had a bad day compared to others, but not that terrible really. Just got stuck home alone and thoughts crept in. Depression hit me above average. But i snapped out late afternoon. I consider it one of the waves we experience in the earlier days where we are up and down many times in 24 hours. Since I've been having a lot more ups than down in this later stage, im suspecting it was nother down moment. I must say, the diwns are way spaced apart now! So if i had one yesterday, I'm guessing next one will be in the middle of next week. Today is going good. I'm rather happy, things that i need to get done really get my mind off the pills. Its much easier now to get distracted away from them I noticed. Also. . Ill add another new gain, events such as going anywhere to do anything are actually giving me no problems. I get slightly happy in realizing I'll get distracted for a few hours. It's almost natural now to get slightly happy in doing normal tasks. Day 17 and it's easier for sure!

    Good news Rhodesy, if depression creeps in... dont sweat it. Let it pass and you'll get happy again. Day 12 isee as still a bit early to make that really good first natural high. Specially your dosages you were on. But i suspect you are very close. Ill bet you will have that magical day within 4 days. Keep in mind that day 14 was mines.

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