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2 month binge after 7 months clean. help.
  1. #1
    aienjell is offline New Member
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    Default 2 month binge after 7 months clean. help.

    Hello, Just some info that may help someone answer my question. I have been addicted to 60-100mg of oxy/hydro for about 8 years and then about a year of 40mg methadone daily. The WD's from methadone being the worst experience of my life(month+ of most of the acute symptoms and a couple more months lingering ones.) I ended up quitting methadone CT and that was early April, I was able to stay clean for about 7 months but because of life and my inability to manage anxiety I started sniffing H about a couple of months ago. Well, after two+ months of forgetting how horrible it felt to be dependant on opiates again I decided to try tapering with the only two subs I could find. I've just tapered from suboxone in about a week and a half span with about 12mg of subs and jumped at .50. I'm on day 5 now without any subs or opiate and can't really note any significant WD's since jumping. What I was hoping to know was, could I have gotten lucky and dodged a bullet(WD's) with such a short taper? I was looking around for a sub doctor two days ago in fear that I would need more time to get off safely but if I've somehow managed to avoid the nightmare that is acute WD's I think I will be able to manage long enough to get the right kind of help to deal with my anxiety. Sorry such a long post, any feedback is appreciated. Hopefully soon as I'm freaking out about something sneaking up on me. CT from methadone and about two weeks with the worst RLS admittedly has me pretty nervous even though I'm 5 days in, Thanks.
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  2. #2
    Ming23 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by aienjell View Post
    Hello, Just some info that may help someone answer my question. I have been addicted to 60-100mg of oxy/hydro for about 8 years and then about a year of 40mg methadone daily. The WD's from methadone being the worst experience of my life(month+ of most of the acute symptoms and a couple more months lingering ones.) I ended up quitting methadone CT and that was early April, I was able to stay clean for about 7 months but because of life and my inability to manage anxiety I started sniffing H about a couple of months ago. Well, after two+ months of forgetting how horrible it felt to be dependant on opiates again I decided to try tapering with the only two subs I could find. I've just tapered from suboxone in about a week and a half span with about 12mg of subs and jumped at .50. I'm on day 5 now without any subs or opiate and can't really note any significant WD's since jumping. What I was hoping to know was, could I have gotten lucky and dodged a bullet(WD's) with such a short taper? I was looking around for a sub doctor two days ago in fear that I would need more time to get off safely but if I've somehow managed to avoid the nightmare that is acute WD's I think I will be able to manage long enough to get the right kind of help to deal with my anxiety. Sorry such a long post, any feedback is appreciated. Hopefully soon as I'm freaking out about something sneaking up on me. CT from methadone and about two weeks with the worst RLS admittedly has me pretty nervous even though I'm 5 days in, Thanks.
    Hi Aingell
    So, let me understand--you only took 12 mg of subs total and jumped 5 days ago at .5mg? You had a 2-month H habit prior to that. Keep posting how you're feeling. Today is your fifth day off subs? Get some Imodium just in case.
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    aienjell is offline New Member
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    Hello, Ming23
    Thanks for replying. Yes, after after quitting methadone 9 months ago I started using H two months ago everyday until I started the subs. all I had were two 8mg films and 4mg of it was confiscated by a sheriff. I inducted at 1.5mg, Last night actually started day 5 and although I said I've had no withdrawals, that isn't entirely true just nothing bad enough to really mention compared to any other WD I've been through(very minor back aches, anxiety which has always been there and feeling lethargic). I did have a mild case of RLS last night that I can't be sure wasn't caused by my paranoia to it. It was the worst of all symptoms to get through. I'm up and still not feeling any significant WD's(stomach is going crazy but no movement yet or cramps/pain). My paranoid mind is telling me that I'm not this lucky and that sooner or later it's going to catch up with me. Oh, and no cravings, just shame for hitting the reset button again. Thanks again, Ming23.
    Last edited by Anonymous; 01-07-2016 at 08:38 AM.
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    Ming23 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by aienjell View Post
    Hello, Ming23
    Thanks for replying. Yes, after after quitting methadone 9 months ago I started using H two months ago everyday until I started the subs. all I had were two 8mg films and 4mg of it was confiscated by a sheriff. I inducted at 1.5mg, Last night actually started day 5 and although I said I've had no withdrawals, that isn't entirely true just nothing bad enough to really mention compared to any other WD I've been through(very minor back aches, anxiety which has always been there and feeling lethargic). I did have a mild case of RLS last night that I can't be sure wasn't caused by my paranoia to it. It was the worst of all symptoms to get through. I'm up and still not feeling any significant WD's(stomach is going crazy but no movement yet or cramps/pain). My paranoid mind is telling me that I'm not this lucky and that sooner or later it's going to catch up with me. Oh, and no cravings, just shame for hitting the reset button again. Thanks again, Ming23.
    Hi Aingell
    So now you re-inducted at 1.5 mg of subs, correct? Sub is very strong and u might not need more. I would ask Randy or Bette for advice.
    Hang in there. do u have more subs?
    Why did you choose subs to deal with a relatively short term H addiction? Overkill?
    If it was me, i would ask Randy what he thinks. He knows things...

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    silverlining1 is offline Senior Member
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    Hey, Aienjell.....

    If this is your day 5 off of sub.....and jumped from .5mg.......I think you will be fine. I don't think anything is going to sneak up on you. You used a total of 12 mg of sub and tapered quickly in a week and a half, you inducted low, which was smart.
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  6. #6
    aienjell is offline New Member
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    Sorry for the confusion, no, I inducted only once at 1.5 about 16 hours after my last hit of H and tapered down to .50 over the course of about 12 days and jumped. On day 5 without anything since I used up the rest of the subs. I tried to find more so I could jump at a lower dose but thankfully I couldn't find any because I may have just kept taking it indefinitely. I never used H before and from what I understand it was pretty low grade but I did go from one bag to a bundle in that two month span, don't know if that qualifies as overkill. I chose subs because I was getting sick the next morning from H and the impending withdrawals scared the hell out of me after being clean for 7 months. Found this site and read alot of threads on sub taper success along with the hope that I hadn't been on H for that long and hoped I could beat the WD's relatively easy. Unfortunately as this day has progressed I have been anxiety ridden(normal for me) and craving something bad but no WD's besides the mental part. I'm going to continue using this thread as sort of a journal to keep myself positive throughout this process. I messed this last time because I couldn't deal with the anxiety everyday and wasn't aware of the amount of time it can take to heal the brain for a long time addict. PAWS lasted the 7 months I was clean but instead of self medicating I will see a doctor to try and treat my anxiety without and addictive agent like benzos or opiates.
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    aienjell is offline New Member
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    Hey, silverlining1

    I really hope so, I lost everything I cared about because of this addiction and about 9 years later have to start from scratch again. I've always had anxiety/depression but never thought about suicide so much until getting clean 9 months ago. PAWS really took a toll on me and now that I know how long this is going to last I plan on treating the root of my addiction(anxiety). Thank you for your feedback. I feel alot better just hearing it from someone else.

  8. #8
    Ming23 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by aienjell View Post
    Sorry for the confusion, no, I inducted only once at 1.5 about 16 hours after my last hit of H and tapered down to .50 over the course of about 12 days and jumped. On day 5 without anything since I used up the rest of the subs. I tried to find more so I could jump at a lower dose but thankfully I couldn't find any because I may have just kept taking it indefinitely. I never used H before and from what I understand it was pretty low grade but I did go from one bag to a bundle in that two month span, don't know if that qualifies as overkill. I chose subs because I was getting sick the next morning from H and the impending withdrawals scared the hell out of me after being clean for 7 months. Found this site and read alot of threads on sub taper success along with the hope that I hadn't been on H for that long and hoped I could beat the WD's relatively easy. Unfortunately as this day has progressed I have been anxiety ridden(normal for me) and craving something bad but no WD's besides the mental part. I'm going to continue using this thread as sort of a journal to keep myself positive throughout this process. I messed this last time because I couldn't deal with the anxiety everyday and wasn't aware of the amount of time it can take to heal the brain for a long time addict. PAWS lasted the 7 months I was clean but instead of self medicating I will see a doctor to try and treat my anxiety without and addictive agent like benzos or opiates.
    Hey Aingel
    There's no way to not have any wds. You wanna play, you gotta pay.
    Even if u take subs, in the end, u will have to withdraw from them.
    I'm on day 11 after jumping at .125 mg. I have had flu-like symptoms since day 6.
    If i were you, and this is just me, i would just kick the H with whatever comfort meds i had. But i wouldn't use subs.
    Others may not agree.
    Low-grade H can be kicked in a few days to a week. Subs will take MUCH longer and then you have to get off the loooooong-acting subs. They stay in your system a long time.
    Have you read the Thomas Recipe? Google it.
    I know people who got off H using that method.
    Hang in there...

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    aienjell is offline New Member
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    Ming23
    Dont I know it! Your opening sentence is the reason why I'm so nervous 5 days in. My intentions were to do a very short term taper from the beginning as I was banking on my clean time and the fact that I've never used subs before to make a difference with this detox. I may have dodged a bullet! WD's are about as scary as having a gun pointed at me. Hopefully this was just a speed bump in recovery and I can continue to work on sobriety. I have read about the thomas recipe but dont really want to take a medley of things to get by since I'm not really withdrawing and even though it's probably frowned on, I found that pot helped after the acute WD's subsided and will use that for a week or two since I have no attachment to it and it relaxed me until I was ready to be productive again. How long were you on subs before your taper and did you have WD's day 1-6 clean from it? Btw, congrats on 11 days free, I hope to hear from you throughout your sobriety. We are all in this together!
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    Ming23 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by aienjell View Post
    Ming23
    Dont I know it! Your opening sentence is the reason why I'm so nervous 5 days in. My intentions were to do a very short term taper from the beginning as I was banking on my clean time and the fact that I've never used subs before to make a difference with this detox. I may have dodged a bullet! WD's are about as scary as having a gun pointed at me. Hopefully this was just a speed bump in recovery and I can continue to work on sobriety. I have read about the thomas recipe but dont really want to take a medley of things to get by since I'm not really withdrawing and even though it's probably frowned on, I found that pot helped after the acute WD's subsided and will use that for a week or two since I have no attachment to it and it relaxed me until I was ready to be productive again. How long were you on subs before your taper and did you have WD's day 1-6 clean from it? Btw, congrats on 11 days free, I hope to hear from you throughout your sobriety. We are all in this together!
    Aingell
    I was on 60 mg methadone (only 4 months) and inducted onto subs to get off it. I spent nearly 4 months tapering off an initial dose of not more than 8 mg subs. I had little to no wd days 1-5 after jumping off subs at .125 mg. Then i developed flu-like symptoms on Day 6, complete with multiple sneezing. I still have flu-like symptoms on Day 11, but Nothing like it was earlier on. In fact, every day i get slightly stronger.
    The brain also needs time to heal. I was depressed at times. Drink a lot of water to flush out the chems.
    You'll be fine. If i could do this, you can too!!
    Hang in there!
    Last edited by Anonymous; 01-07-2016 at 01:18 PM.

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    aienjell is offline New Member
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    @Ming23
    Halfway through day 5 now and am so drained of energy, anxiety and the "machinegun sneezing" has started... Damn I hope this doesn't turn out so bad or for too long even though this is the price of admission. Oh well, I am going to stay as positive as I can and pray it doesn't get worse. Maybe the half life keeps symptoms at bay for a little longer than 3 days. I'm going to stick this out no matter what. I cant wait to hear you got througI'm rooting for you too
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  12. #12
    Ming23 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by aienjell View Post
    @Ming23
    Halfway through day 5 now and am so drained of energy, anxiety and the "machinegun sneezing" has started... Damn I hope this doesn't turn out so bad or for too long even though this is the price of admission. Oh well, I am going to stay as positive as I can and pray it doesn't get worse. Maybe the half life keeps symptoms at bay for a little longer than 3 days. I'm going to stick this out no matter what. I cant wait to hear you got througI'm rooting for you too
    Aienjell
    I made it through! This is day 11 off subs for me.
    I also had that sneezing. 8 in a row sometimes!
    Try to stay hydrated because the body is cleansing itself now that u stopped taking the subs. Remember, even at low doses, it stays in your system for 72-hours, and then another 72 hours to be fully gone!
    Just hang in there. Got distractions? TV, books, whatever's to your liking...

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    aienjell is offline New Member
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    Lol, Yes you did! I meant completely symptom free(physical). If it was just sneezing we had to worry about I'd never consider quitting. Admittedly, I haven't been hydrating much at all so I will start now and try to stay active and out of my head. I know how much getting out can help with everything, jogged most of the aches and pains out last time. Really worried about another night with RLS(mild last night) wasn't as bad as I'm used to and stayed up watching movies until I fell asleep around 3am and will have pot to combat that tonight and until it's gone. One day at a time. This should be cake compared to kicking methadone CT. Later, Ming23!
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    aienjell is offline New Member
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    Day 6 is starting off pretty >>>>>> already. Mild lower back muscle aches, dehydrated and no sleep last night from RLS. Probably going to be laboring all day but it's not so bad that I won't leave the house. This was the hardest part last time, knowing I'm physically too unwell to "jump back into life."
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  15. #15
    Ming23 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by aienjell View Post
    Day 6 is starting off pretty >>>>>> already. Mild lower back muscle aches, dehydrated and no sleep last night from RLS. Probably going to be laboring all day but it's not so bad that I won't leave the house. This was the hardest part last time, knowing I'm physically too unwell to "jump back into life."
    Ainjell
    Fight off dehydration! It will make you feel even sicker than you may be! Drink water! Sip some every 30 minutes at least!
    I watched a friend's mother get admitted to hospital recently with chest pains. Turns out she was dehydrated.
    The additional benefit is that after a short time,, your skin will begin to glow as the body becomes hydrated. I'm looking at my hands now--shining!
    I take a product called Calm, which is magnesium powder and immediately ends leg cramps. The health food store has some good products. Btw, leg cramps are exacerbated by dehydration. They get worse if you haven't drunk enough water.
    Don't know about jogging. Whatever works for you! Exercise releases endorphines and that ain't a bad thing. Just remember that moderation is the key now. Don't want to tax your system too much.
    You can do this!
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  16. #16
    momtobe2016 is offline Junior Member
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    I will second the magnesium. I have withdrawn from opiates before and had terrible RLS and body aches. This time, it is much better. I've also been doing yoga, and find that helps, too. The first sign of withdrawal for me was always low back pain, and both magnesium and yoga help make this manageable--I had it so bad before that I couldn't sit still in my chair at work. Epsom salt baths can be good, too.

    Don't beat yourself up too much about your relapse--it will only make things worse, and I am sure there are valuable lessons you can take away from it (i.e. you absolutely cannot be a casual user and never will be able to, anxiety is a trigger for you and you need tools to manage it, etc.). I got my "$20,000 Big Book" in rehab in 2010 to get off alcohol. I haven't had a problem with it since and had no desire to use it, but I started using opiates and benzos (without a prescription, a family member turned me on to the combo) to manage my migraines and got hooked. I knew my use was somewhat out of control and the great effect I originally got from them was usually elusive, but I didn't have any consequences and didn't have a reason to stop until I got pregnant. So, my doc put me on subs, and here I am. TL;DR: I totally relate to what you are going though, but have found that if I let the guilt get to me, everything is much worse. We are here to get better, and that is huge. Many addicts don't even get there and then die of overdose/addiction. Best of luck with getting off drugs, and I know you can do this!
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  17. #17
    aienjell is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ming23 View Post
    Ainjell
    Fight off dehydration! It will make you feel even sicker than you may be! Drink water! Sip some every 30 minutes at least!
    I watched a friend's mother get admitted to hospital recently with chest pains. Turns out she was dehydrated.
    The additional benefit is that after a short time,, your skin will begin to glow as the body becomes hydrated. I'm looking at my hands now--shining!
    I take a product called Calm, which is magnesium powder and immediately ends leg cramps. The health food store has some good products. Btw, leg cramps are exacerbated by dehydration. They get worse if you haven't drunk enough water.
    Don't know about jogging. Whatever works for you! Exercise releases endorphines and that ain't a bad thing. Just remember that moderation is the key now. Don't want to tax your system too much.
    You can do this!

    Ming
    Thanks again for your support. I have been drinking water like a fish, eating, and multivitamins while avoiding caffeine and no help with the back aches. Completely drained after something as light as walking the dog but the anxiety associated with RLS seems to be gone now, just a little uncomfortable at night but getting sleep now so that's progress! Jogging is gonna have to wait either way, it's freezing in NY. I can't wait to feel good enough to trust my body to get through work unscathed, I lost two decent jobs during my last recovery because I wasn't ready. Btw, how are you feeling now? You have to be on about day 14-15 now, right?
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  18. #18
    aienjell is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by momtobe2016 View Post
    I will second the magnesium. I have withdrawn from opiates before and had terrible RLS and body aches. This time, it is much better. I've also been doing yoga, and find that helps, too. The first sign of withdrawal for me was always low back pain, and both magnesium and yoga help make this manageable--I had it so bad before that I couldn't sit still in my chair at work. Epsom salt baths can be good, too.

    Don't beat yourself up too much about your relapse--it will only make things worse, and I am sure there are valuable lessons you can take away from it (i.e. you absolutely cannot be a casual user and never will be able to, anxiety is a trigger for you and you need tools to manage it, etc.). I got my "$20,000 Big Book" in rehab in 2010 to get off alcohol. I haven't had a problem with it since and had no desire to use it, but I started using opiates and benzos (without a prescription, a family member turned me on to the combo) to manage my migraines and got hooked. I knew my use was somewhat out of control and the great effect I originally got from them was usually elusive, but I didn't have any consequences and didn't have a reason to stop until I got pregnant. So, my doc put me on subs, and here I am. TL;DR: I totally relate to what you are going though, but have found that if I let the guilt get to me, everything is much worse. We are here to get better, and that is huge. Many addicts don't even get there and then die of overdose/addiction. Best of luck with getting off drugs, and I know you can do this!

    Hello, momtobe

    Thanks for the advice. You are right, I'll never manage staying clean without tools to manage anxiety as well. I was prescribed anti anxiety and anti depressants today and was told they can take up to two weeks to take effect so hopefully it helps because as much as I fear withdrawals, I fear paralyzing anxiety just as much. I made sure to tell the Dr. no benzos, don't need another addiction. Things suck but they are getting better and nowhere near as bad as detoxing CT.

  19. #19
    Ming23 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by aienjell View Post
    Ming
    Thanks again for your support. I have been drinking water like a fish, eating, and multivitamins while avoiding caffeine and no help with the back aches. Completely drained after something as light as walking the dog but the anxiety associated with RLS seems to be gone now, just a little uncomfortable at night but getting sleep now so that's progress! Jogging is gonna have to wait either way, it's freezing in NY. I can't wait to feel good enough to trust my body to get through work unscathed, I lost two decent jobs during my last recovery because I wasn't ready. Btw, how are you feeling now? You have to be on about day 14-15 now, right?
    Ainjell
    Yes. I felt good yesterday and woke up ok today. It's been 16 days off subs. Felt lije i had the flu days 6-14. All things pass! Yup, walking dog was ruff!
    How's NY?

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