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Day 4 no oxy subs not helping
  1. #1
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    Default Day 4 no oxy subs not helping

    I need some encouragement I've been taking about 400mg oxy and sometimes 600mg for months anyways Friday I switched to subs and I still feel like >>>>. I was so hoping to feel better today yesterday I took 8mg subs
    The previous two days I took 16mg Idk why I still have no energy, bone aches, hot flashes etc.

    Please tell me there id's light at the end of this tunnel. I'm so close I think but also so ready to go back to oxy just to feel better.

  2. #2
    Catrina is offline Diamond Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ce2700 View Post
    I need some encouragement I've been taking about 400mg oxy and sometimes 600mg for months anyways Friday I switched to subs and I still feel like >>>>. I was so hoping to feel better today yesterday I took 8mg subs
    The previous two days I took 16mg Idk why I still have no energy, bone aches, hot flashes etc.

    Please tell me there id's light at the end of this tunnel. I'm so close I think but also so ready to go back to oxy just to feel better.
    Hi Ce,

    I've seen you on these boards before, haven't I? (Not said in a mean way. I played this rodeo countless times. I think I recognize you is all).

    OK. You need to remember that with subs, less is more. 16mg/day is wayyyyy to much even with how much oxy you're coming off of. Even 8 is a huge amount. I've seen lots (LOTS) of people induct on subs with H habits or high doses of oxy. Honestly, I can't recall anyone needing more that 6mg of sub a day and most often no more 4. I think that you're taking too much. How much did you take on Friday through Tuesday? Very important not to bounce around. You should find the lowest possible dose to not have symptoms and then don't go higher. The lack of energy you're having is likely because you're taking too much. Sub feels very different than the oxys and many people make the mistake of taking too much because they feel different.

    It's going to take a few days to get you feeling better because you've got quite a bit of sub in your system right now. Absolutely don't increase your dose. Is the lack of energy the only symptom you're having right now? Are you game to get your dose under control so that you can stabilize? We can help. Let us know. Better to catch this now before you go longer on high doses of sub. You won't be sorry. Once you stabilize, then you can follow the taper plan used here.

    Peace,

    Cat
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  3. #3
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    Hi cat thanks for posting no I have basically no energy, bone aches, hot cold flashes, typical wd symptoms just to a lesser degree.

    Day 1 I took 16
    Day 2 the same
    Day 3 8mg
    Today 8mg
    I can't feel better I'm supposed to be going on vacation this weekend and I'm afraid that if by tomorrow I can't feel somewhat better I'm going to end up failing again I can't feel like this still by Saturday I'm leaving. And I know what lerks if I go back.


    Yes you have seen me here before I had 11 years sober gave it away and have struggled ever since. I'm at a loss I just want to stabilize but I don't know how without my oxy. I know I did this all wrong yet again. Wtf is wrong with me.

    Is There Any chance off me stabilizing by Saturday?

  4. #4
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    Btw my doc is obviously an Asshole just have me a script and told me to take 3 a day spread out I knew that's wrong
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  5. #5
    Catrina is offline Diamond Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ce2700 View Post
    Btw my doc is obviously an Asshole just have me a script and told me to take 3 a day spread out I knew that's wrong
    Hi Ce,

    The one thing I know for sure is that you don't want to increase your daily dose. That will make matters worse. Will you stabilize by Saturday? I hope so. You've got a lot of sub in your system right now and there's nothing you can do but wait it out, I'm afraid. Whatever you do don't increase it thinking it will help because it won't it will only make you feel worse.

    Are you dosing once or twice a day? How long will you be gone for? Geez. So not a good time to figure this out, is it???

    Peace,

    Cat
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  6. #6
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    Hi cat today only once I took a whole 8 mg film not planning on doing another. I don't know what to do I feel helpless go back to oxy after suffering nearly 5 days now I feel that's the only way I'll get threw this vacation at this point. I really don't know what to do each day I hope will be better but it's really not

  7. #7
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    I'll be gone until the 5th

  8. #8
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    I'm tempted to stop sub use and go back to oxy but I know that won't help matters

  9. #9
    Catrina is offline Diamond Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ce2700 View Post
    Hi cat today only once I took a whole 8 mg film not planning on doing another. I don't know what to do I feel helpless go back to oxy after suffering nearly 5 days now I feel that's the only way I'll get threw this vacation at this point. I really don't know what to do each day I hope will be better but it's really not
    I don't think that the oxy will break through the subs. You've got suboxone right and not subutex? I am tempted to suggest that you try not to dose tomorrow to get some of the sub out of your system. How about at least not dosing in the morning and see how you feel. If you don't feel worse, try to make it the day. If you start to get sick, you can always dose. Ya know? Not a good idea to do this all the time but maybe you should to see if you an stabilize. You shouldn't be sick from withdrawing from the oxy. This has got to be too much sub. Especially because 16 also made you sick so we know it's not that you need more. 16mg/day is insane.

    What do you think? Want to try this?

    Peace,

    Cat
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  10. #10
    Catrina is offline Diamond Member
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    And when you do start to feel the withdrawals again, you can begin with a lower dose than the 8mg and increase slowly to see how much you need as opposed to what you were prescribed or are taking now.
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  11. #11
    UncleLeo is offline Advanced Member
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    Still no relief? Yeah - maybe let your system clear a bit? Then add a little and see if you get relief - should come within 15-20 mins...hang in there.
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  12. #12
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    I can try that tomorrow. I have nothing to lose at this point with it. Regardless I feel spacy, weak, just way off I'm going to have to grab oxy if I can't get this cleared up and try to reinduce when I get back or something. I can't drive my kids in this head space on our family vacation. Honestly I thought I have myself enough time to stabilize last time by day 4 I felt great this time not so much. I just pray I wake up feeling better tomorrow. It would be a miracle at this point that is what I need a miracle I feel
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  13. #13
    Ricky71 is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ce2700 View Post
    I can try that tomorrow. I have nothing to lose at this point with it. Regardless I feel spacy, weak, just way off I'm going to have to grab oxy if I can't get this cleared up and try to reinduce when I get back or something. I can't drive my kids in this head space on our family vacation. Honestly I thought I have myself enough time to stabilize last time by day 4 I felt great this time not so much. I just pray I wake up feeling better tomorrow. It would be a miracle at this point that is what I need a miracle I feel
    Hello Ce - if you end up back on the Oxy and you plan to try the sub induction again at a later date then please follow Robert's sub taper plan! Follow it exactly as outlined, if you need help at that time then members here on the boards will guide you through the process? Here's a link to Robert's sub plan - https://www.drugs.com/forum/suboxone...apy-66109.html

    You're going to use the COWS worksheet to induct, here's a link for that as well - https://www.drugs.com/resources/opio...wal-record.pdf

    You'll need to score at least 26 before you start your induction! Very important to score at least a 26!!!! Follow Robert's plan to a "T"... You're only going to start with .5mg then .25mg every 1.5 hours until you're stable with little to no withdrawal symptoms! As Cat has mentioned you took way too much sub and most people become stable on 4mg or less! Keep us posted? Be well... God bless us all!

  14. #14
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    Do you think it best too just get back on my oxy and try again using that method then what has happened?

  15. #15
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    I really don't know what to do. I feel so blahh id hate to think that this whole week of no work etc for nothing. This sucks

  16. #16
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    If I go back would someone walk me threw hope to do this properly. I've read that but it's almost like I just need one on one that day with someone experienced I clearly don't know how too follow directions. Grown ass man and I'm in this spot sucks no control over my life I feel

  17. #17
    Iluv2smile is offline Platinum Member
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    The oxy won't break through the sub.
    You will be wasting your time and money..
    Just wait it out..
    You have got to be sick of this..
    Right?
    You will stabilize so why go through all this shhhhiiitttt again..


    It sounds like you want to go back on the oxy to feel better..
    But they won't even help right now
    You have to much sub in your system..
    Way to much..
    I would do as cat suggested..
    Bette
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  18. #18
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    I think I'm going to have to just start over Idk if I don't feel better tomorrow I'm getting my rx and usually takes symptoms away quick even with the suboxone for me. It's almost like my body doesn't absorb it well.

    Is that possible this isn't my first rodeo and I can twaddle a 8mg film in the am and 4 oxy at night and feel better that's not normal based on what I've read
    Last edited by Anonymous; 06-30-2016 at 08:58 PM.

  19. #19
    Ricky71 is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ce2700 View Post
    If I go back would someone walk me threw hope to do this properly. I've read that but it's almost like I just need one on one that day with someone experienced I clearly don't know how too follow directions. Grown ass man and I'm in this spot sucks no control over my life I feel
    Yes, someone here will definitely help and guide you during your induction! As Cat has already mentioned taking any Oxy right now will probably do nothing because of the Suboxone that's still in your system, the Suboxone will block the Oxy! You'll have to stop taking the subs for a few days probably then you can try the Oxy to see if it provides any relief if that's what you really want to do? Or you can do as Cat has suggested and slow down with the sub and wait to stabilize? In the the meantime study Robert's sub taper plan, read it again and again! Hang in there! I wish you well... God bless us all!

    PS
    Be careful with language, mods will delete your posts/thread!
    Last edited by Anonymous; 06-30-2016 at 09:00 PM.

  20. #20
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    Sorry about language my apologies if anybody was offended and please delete whatever you have to delete

  21. #21
    Ricky71 is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ce2700 View Post
    Sorry about language my apologies if anybody was offended and please delete whatever you have to delete
    No worries... Trust me I'm not offended but some words will get your post and/or thread deleted from the mods so just a warning. It sux to write a post and have it deleted, it's happened to me and many others as well!

  22. #22
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    Got ya will thanks for the heads up. Okay well update I broke down and took 60mg oxy and by what everyone says I shouldn't feel anything but I immediately regained energy and feel 100 percent better almost instantly. Not sure how this is possible based on everything I've read all my receptors should be filled and oxy should do nothing.

    So question is there any people that just don't absorb suboxone well? I want off the oxy but I just needed a little relief and it came instantly how is this possible? I'm gonna see how I feel when I wake up because I really don't want to get back to where I was but I may now that I know three oxy still gets me threw use it to my advantage for the vacation weekend considering the subs weren't providing relief.

    Anyways I need thoughts and opinions this has literally been a lost week with little relief and I just had to see if the oxy would help and it did. So I really don't know where to go from here. Am I different, is it possible I don't absorb suboxone well? I forgot to say when I initially induced I was about 18hours into detox and started somewhat small 2mg 4, then 8 no relief then 16 still nothing. Now I take 60mg oxy about 16 hours after sub dose this mourning 7am 8 mg.

    Going by what is said about receptors being full etc etc how could I get any relief from the oxy but I did. I was able to eat finally, for energy back, etc. It just don't add up but I had to see if it would help because the subs weren't and it did instantly.
    .thoughts?

    I really need off these things and I am willing to listen and follow direction if somebody id's willing to hold my hand threw this. And I have read and re- read Roberts taper plan and think I understand it now. Any ways looking for help and thoughts. Thanks to all that is trying to help me

  23. #23
    Ricky71 is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ce2700 View Post
    Got ya will thanks for the heads up. Okay well update I broke down and took 60mg oxy and by what everyone says I shouldn't feel anything but I immediately regained energy and feel 100 percent better almost instantly. Not sure how this is possible based on everything I've read all my receptors should be filled and oxy should do nothing.

    So question is there any people that just don't absorb suboxone well? I want off the oxy but I just needed a little relief and it came instantly how is this possible? I'm gonna see how I feel when I wake up because I really don't want to get back to where I was but I may now that I know three oxy still gets me threw use it to my advantage for the vacation weekend considering the subs weren't providing relief.

    Anyways I need thoughts and opinions this has literally been a lost week with little relief and I just had to see if the oxy would help and it did. So I really don't know where to go from here. Am I different, is it possible I don't absorb suboxone well? I forgot to say when I initially induced I was about 18hours into detox and started somewhat small 2mg 4, then 8 no relief then 16 still nothing. Now I take 60mg oxy about 16 hours after sub dose this mourning 7am 8 mg.

    Going by what is said about receptors being full etc etc how could I get any relief from the oxy but I did. I was able to eat finally, for energy back, etc. It just don't add up but I had to see if it would help because the subs weren't and it did instantly.
    .thoughts?

    I really need off these things and I am willing to listen and follow direction if somebody id's willing to hold my hand threw this. And I have read and re- read Roberts taper plan and think I understand it now. Any ways looking for help and thoughts. Thanks to all that is trying to help me
    I'm not sure with the sub and the oxy in your case? You may have a super fast metabolism, did you take the suboxone correctly (dissolve under your tongue for twenty minutes)? I know of someone who can go back and forth from oxy to subs with no problem either, they can do subs for a few days and start right back on the oxy, who knows? I'm going to copy the post I sent you earlier since you have taking the oxy now, I would recommend that you do this this next time your ready to try sub therapy again? It is extremely important to induct correctly on the subs, you must be in full withdrawal scoring a minimum of 26 on the COWS worksheet before you induct, you must start with a .5mg piece and then wait 1.5 hours before you dose again? You then dose .25mg every 1.5 hours until stable? here's the copy of that post again -

    Hello Ce - if you end up back on the Oxy and you plan to try the sub induction again at a later date then please follow Robert's sub taper plan! Follow it exactly as outlined, if you need help at that time then members here on the boards will guide you through the process? Here's a link to Robert's sub plan - https://www.drugs.com/forum/suboxone...apy-66109.html

    You're going to use the COWS worksheet to induct, here's a link for that as well - https://www.drugs.com/resources/opio...wal-record.pdf

    You'll need to score at least 26 before you start your induction! Very important to score at least a 26!!!! Follow Robert's plan to a "T"... You're only going to start with .5mg then .25mg every 1.5 hours until you're stable with little to no withdrawal symptoms! As Cat has mentioned you took way too much sub and most people become stable on 4mg or less! Keep us posted? Be well... God bless us all!

    PS
    Catrina and Bette have a lot of knowledge about subs and the inner workings of Robert's plan so listen to them! We are here to help when you're ready to get on the subs again, keep us posted?
    Last edited by Anonymous; 08-30-2016 at 06:22 PM.

  24. #24
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    Thanks. Well I woke up feeling a little better then normal now I don't know what to do. Should I wait it out and see how I feel later I just want to feel normal. My stomach is killing me

  25. #25
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    I guess I'll just stay on the oxy until I get back assert least I know what to expect.

  26. #26
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    BTW yes I would always take the sub as prescribed it would create a ton of saliva really quickly though and id have a mouth full within minutes I don't know if maybe that's part of the problem. I just don't know

  27. #27
    Catrina is offline Diamond Member
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    Good Morning Ce,

    Very odd that you felt the oxy. I agree. I know you're stressing about going away for the weekend. (Can't believe I'm about to say this....). Maybe you should go back to the oxy but take as little as possible, please. When you get back, come back here and let's try to do this all over again.

    It's sounds promising to me that you felt better this morning (not perfect but better). I still think it's because of the high doses of subs. The next few days will give it a chance to leave your system. You inducted only 18 hrs after your last dose of oxy so that may just be a part of why you were so sick too. This next time, wait, wait, wait and the sicker the better before you take your first dose. Then start very slowly. It was/is probably a combination of inducting too soon and at too high a dose.

    Have a good few days and then come back here. Don't give up on this. If you do it right next time, you won't be sorry.

    Peace,

    Cat
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  28. #28
    UncleLeo is offline Advanced Member
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    It's like Bette always says, you spend enough time training your body in a certain way...then flip things overnight, it's gonna be very very confused, sometimes for a longer period of time than others, depending on all sorts of factors like length of time of the original med and dosage, etc etc.

    Hang in there! Week wasn't regardless either way. You learned what to do or not to do...esp a couple days before a big family trip...

  29. #29
    Ce2700 is offline Junior Member
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    Thanks for the encouraging words. I will be back Tuesday and trying this again. I can't go away feeling the way I did and now I feel more myself again back on the oxy unfortunately but I will do this right next week. I just couldn't get there all the way I guess I held out as long as I could but guess I did things all wrong. My doctor sucks btw he wanted me on 24mg a day and I was a total mess on 16mg space case to say the least. Anyways thanks to all and I will be doing this right
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  30. #30
    Ming23 is offline Platinum Member
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    Hey Ce
    Perhaps it would be wise to consider not getting on subs since small doses of oxy maintain you. Why not just taper or cold turkey the oxys? You were on too high a dose of subs anyway for the amount of oxy you were on.
    Think about alternate options this weekend. Catrina says in 5 days you can be free of the pills and she has done it. That is, cold turkey. If u go on subs, the wd is worse. You eventually have to taper off the subs.
    Get down to as low a dose as you can on the Oxy.
    You can be done with this in less than 2 weeks without subs!

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