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How to deal with the reasons why you used prior opioids/sub?
  1. #1
    GoodDaysAhead is offline Member
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    Question How to deal with the reasons why you used prior opioids/sub?

    Hey guys, it's now been 1 year and 9 days since I jumped from Sub. I was on Methadone for 8 years due to opioid abuse. I switched to Suboxone for about a year & 1/2, then had to switch back to Methadone due to weight side effects from the Sub (was back on Methadone for about a year) and then thought tapering/jumping from Sub would be easier (it wasn't), so back on Sub for 4 months before I jumped last summer. I tapered down to half mg before jumping.
    I still have many good days in a row, but am still noticing those off days, as well as certain times during the day (especially mornings) where I feel really antisocial and full of anxiety. it's the reason opioids seemed to click with me.

    I felt so much better on opioids, where I wasn't stressed by people/places. Its weird, because I can have some really great days where I feel like I'm "normal" and don't have any anxiety or feel antisocial or anhedonia (which I didn't really feel before opioid use) but then it comes back. I do admit, I have some major issues, and like many addicts, emotional issues are why I took opioids. Maybe EDS? Working out seems to help for a bit and give some hrs of relief but of course, I can't workout/exercise non stop. I do have some good days and I am not sure why some days I feel better than I did before my opioid use....maybe the brain still recalibrating and releasing endorphins where it didn't prior to my use? I do know the reasons why I used in the first place hasn't gone away. I remember the people anxiety was big growing up where I had to fake feeling okay and now that I've been off everything for so long, these issues seem to be resurfacing.

    I guess it would be naive to somehow think that this particular issue is still paws and as time goes by, this too will pass. It's been such a long time since before I began using opioids and is fuzzy, but do remember feeling anxiety back then. I want to think it's just paws and damage is still being repaired but I just don't know. Many don't even experience these issues past 6 months after they jump. So, like many recovering addicts, what do people who used in order to escape issues do once they are in recovery for a while? I've been trying NA, and I see it as good fellowship, but it doesn't help with the reason why I started all this in the first place. I never had restless legs, overall restlessness or sleep issues (haven't slept more than 5 hrs tops in the past year). Prior to any of this.

    I also still have no cravings for opioids or a desire to use anything. I have tired many antidepressants growing up which never seemed to help me. The meds that directly affected the mu receptors (opioids/Methadone/Sub) really did help though. Again, maybe EDS?
    I know many got on opioids because of an injury or some physical ailment, but if those who used for other reasons have any advice, personal experience or have information regarding this would like to respond...it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for listening everyone.
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  2. #2
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    Hey GoodDaysAhead, I see you started another thread, if you keep your story on this one it's easier for people to support you, gets alittle confusing.. keep reading and posting,there are plenty of people here to support you and offer their advice. Weekends are slow here, but I'm sure soon people will drop by with support.. Stay Strong for Today...
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  3. #3
    UncleLeo is offline Advanced Member
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    Hi Good Days - so Lvg recommended I might check out your post...she is very wise. Like reading my own story...

    I've got over a year now too...and often wonder all the same things. I wish I had better answers tho as I think we've had similar journeys...

    I don't really quite know when my suffering really started. It's very hard for me to separate any memory of childhood from those memories...I always thought when every kid went to bed they too prayed to God to let them also not wake up and end their suffering.

    I totally hear you on the exercise...my only answer is - yes you can Maybe not 24 hours but I truly believe now that some of us just come from different hunter-gatherer type tribes where we are meant to be moving at least 2 to 3 times a day in some way or another. And this will unlock us from our angst - at least to the best it can. It does unlock a ton of creativity and vitality that most "normal" people never do get to experience...so we do have some upside...

    Keep posting...will keep responding...

  4. #4
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    Hi Good Days,

    You have come such a long way so I hope that you are proud of where you are now. Opiates, Methadone, Subs, Methadone and Subs and over a year clean. There are lots of folks who will never find a way out but you did.

    Life, how it treats us, and how we respond to things becomes a learning experience once we have some clean time behind us. We can't help but to try and unravel how we got to where we are in the first place. Most especially after long term opiate use, it's confusing trying to sort out what is a part of the process of healing (physically and emotionally) and what has been there all along that we had escaped from with the use of opiates until they became a non-issue. Not all of our issues are directly related to recovery. Life is often hard. Even the most balanced people have days full of anxiety or unexplained out of control emotions. There are some things that we simply have to accept and then there are some things that we need to work on before they get better or at least our ability to deal with those things get better. In the beginning of my recovery after weeks of little or no sleep, when I began to get four or five hours I still wasn't satisfied with that. I had abused opiates for so many years that I honestly couldn't remember how much sleep I needed. I'm now over seven and a half years clean and it turns out that I need -- wait for it -- about five hours of sleep per night.

    I'm sorry that you are still having trouble. I did read that you've tried antidepressants but they don't help. Do you or have you ever gone to therapy? Therapists, like meetings, I think are hit or miss so sometimes you have to keep looking until you find one that fits for you. I know. I always hated the thought of these too but if they help, it's worth it. I think that some professional help might be the best avenue for you to try so that you can begin to sort things out and figure out a way to deal the issues that can be worked on and how you can let go of the things that you simply can't change. Being able to accept things is something that doesn't always come easily to anyone and whether in recovery or not,it truly is the best and only way to get through the hard days.

    What you have described in your post doesn't strike me as PAWS. Sometimes our expectations of what life is all about is different than what it really is. I thought that if only I could get and stay clean, I would live happily ever after. Turns out it wasn't that simple. On top of all of my original issues, I was clean but without the tools I needed to be happy and I had a boat load of new issues. Shame, guilt, and self loathing. Anger, mostly at myself for having lost so many years being in my bubble of self medicating. I had used a pill to fix everything and to fix nothing at all and suddenly (actually not so suddenly) I was left with just me without a clue about what I was supposed to do now. It's painful to dig out all the old history and have to not only look at it closely, but to rip it apart and to keep doing that until it can be let go into the universe. And that's the goal. We can't change the past so the best we can hope for it to just let it go. Easier said than done but with practice (and sometimes with help) that is exactly what we have to learn how to do.

    "Is this all there is?" It will be if you let it. Are you isolating yourself? That's not good for anyone. For most of us, if we're around other people it forces us to at least act "normal" (I hate that word normal). Fake it until you make it, I always say. I know that you have some social anxiety so maybe that's the place to start and try to find a way to overcome that. I really can't imagine that I'd have come so far in my own recovery if I wasn't able to get out of my own head and often times the only way I can do that is to get out among other people.

    I wish I had the answers for you but I guess the best we can do is to listen to as much as we can from others with the hope that something strikes a cord with us. I did learn that I had to stop waiting for the answers to arrive at my doorstep without having to do the work to find them myself. Recovery and life is a journey with lots of bumps in the road along the way. Getting clean and being able to stay that way was only the first necessary step. It's only then that the real work begins and there are no instructions. I know because I sure spent enough time looking for those instructions!

    Peace,

    Cat

  5. #5
    GoodDaysAhead is offline Member
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    Thank you for the encouragement and insight, guys. It's strange because when I created this account, I was back in those good days....hence the user name, and Wednesday was one of the best days I've ever had even pre using. Out of the blue, it was like from morning until night, I had a major flood of endorphins and felt as if I was actually on something like an opioid. Come to think of it, when these days occur, it's much more powerful than any opioid. The feeling of true happiness....almost bliss like where I can't help but smile because of the pure feelings of excitement and joy I feel at that particular time or day. I feel like a goofball smiling for no reason with my fiancé. And it happens when doing many of the exact same things..same places and times of day. I never had these positive emotions prior to use, or even during using. It does feel unnatural and often feels like a cruel joke to be given this, only for it to not only be taken away, but to be replaced with such dread, anhedonia and depersonalization.

    I know Methadone is a purely synthetic opioid agonist, is a full agonist that has a high affinity for the mu receptors, (unlike Sub, which is only partial agonist), and can stay in the system for close to 60 hrs. I often wish I had only been on Suboxone the whole time. I remember not feeling numb on Sub like I did on Methadone. I am in no way laying blame on Methadone....because it was my choice to listen to my doctor and not look things up for myself. Me being naive is not any drug or doctors fault. I guess I just wish I had not been so willing to just go with it without question for so long. That's on me. I know I never want to go back to any type of opioid or agonist again. This, I truly believe would make things a lot worse. No chance of relapse here....which is a good thing, I guess. The intense highs of chemical release, then really lows do worry me. I can remember even back in Feburary when I went away on a trip with my fiancé..I remember telling her while driving back to the hotel how this wasn't normal and that I felt almost too good. I would have thought bipolar come on out of the blue if not for the feelings of calmness and euphoria. Everything stays the same....it's just such euphoric and relaxed emotions. Also, I've noticed an increased empathy for people overall. It's like my brain is trying so hard to work on things. And I'm more than fine with this....if I knew it was just that and not something that is going to linger for years on end.

    I have not dealt with talk therapy, but it couldn't hurt, right? I think I will do this next week. And UncleLeo, I think more exercise will be on the agenda. I've been doing a lot of heavy lifting the past few months and am getting back to my prior last decade use, but I think more cardio would help endorphins even more. Thanks for taking the time to respond Cat and UncleLeo.

    And Lvg, as always, thank you for being there.
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  6. #6
    Catrina is offline Diamond Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoodDaysAhead View Post
    Thank you for the encouragement and insight, guys. It's strange because when I created this account, I was back in those good days....hence the user name, and Wednesday was one of the best days I've ever had even pre using. Out of the blue, it was like from morning until night, I had a major flood of endorphins and felt as if I was actually on something like an opioid. Come to think of it, when these days occur, it's much more powerful than any opioid. The feeling of true happiness....almost bliss like where I can't help but smile because of the pure feelings of excitement and joy I feel at that particular time or day. I feel like a goofball smiling for no reason with my fiancé. And it happens when doing many of the exact same things..same places and times of day. I never had these positive emotions prior to use, or even during using. It does feel unnatural and often feels like a cruel joke to be given this, only for it to not only be taken away, but to be replaced with such dread, anhedonia and depersonalization.

    I know Methadone is a purely synthetic opioid agonist, is a full agonist that has a high affinity for the mu receptors, (unlike Sub, which is only partial agonist), and can stay in the system for close to 60 hrs. I often wish I had only been on Suboxone the whole time. I remember not feeling numb on Sub like I did on Methadone. I am in no way laying blame on Methadone....because it was my choice to listen to my doctor and not look things up for myself. Me being naive is not any drug or doctors fault. I guess I just wish I had not been so willing to just go with it without question for so long. That's on me. I know I never want to go back to any type of opioid or agonist again. This, I truly believe would make things a lot worse. No chance of relapse here....which is a good thing, I guess. The intense highs of chemical release, then really lows do worry me. I can remember even back in Feburary when I went away on a trip with my fiancé..I remember telling her while driving back to the hotel how this wasn't normal and that I felt almost too good. I would have thought bipolar come on out of the blue if not for the feelings of calmness and euphoria. Everything stays the same....it's just such euphoric and relaxed emotions. Also, I've noticed an increased empathy for people overall. It's like my brain is trying so hard to work on things. And I'm more than fine with this....if I knew it was just that and not something that is going to linger for years on end.

    I have not dealt with talk therapy, but it couldn't hurt, right? I think I will do this next week. And UncleLeo, I think more exercise will be on the agenda. I've been doing a lot of heavy lifting the past few months and am getting back to my prior last decade use, but I think more cardio would help endorphins even more. Thanks for taking the time to respond Cat and UncleLeo.

    And Lvg, as always, thank you for being there.
    Aha! I now understand what you were asking. YES! The ups and downs are absolutely expected. I recall posting on my own thread years ago wondering if I was bipolar. I never had been but the intense highs and crashes were unsettling. I did enjoy the highs though. I totally understand how you feel when that happens. Just insane, intense happiness. Just not normal, right? Just keep trucking. Things will settle down but I still recommend that you find a therapist. It certainly won't hurt. We could all use a little therapy and there's nothing wrong with that.

    Peace,

    Cast
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  7. #7
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    Good Morning. , GoodDaysAhead, all in the name... Appreciate how far you have come, how strong you are for it.. Today's a good day to live.... worrying does not empty tomorrow's of it's troubles...it emptys today's of it's Strength.. I too have great days and low days, I feel like at times I have set unrealistic goals for myself, so when those not so good days linger, I begin to convince myself that I should be doing and feeling more.. Life on life's terms..I've put my time in so every day should be wonderful, exciting ya know. Just have to stop and appreciate what's right in front of you Today... Be Proud of Yourself... I am Proud of You... you are truly worth it my friend... here it is This too Shall pass....eh
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  8. #8
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    What's up GoodDaysAhead... Hope you are having an amazing day with the fiance... goofball feeling eh.... Stay Strong for Today...it's all we got my friend....

  9. #9
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    Hello GoodDaysAhead,. Better day today... Counseling tonight lol

  10. #10
    GoodDaysAhead is offline Member
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    Yes, it's a much better day today. That last one went on for 4 days but feeling better today. I just wanna grab my brain and say "listen bud, I know you've been through heck and back, and I feel for you but get with the program and help me out so we can feel better" (grabbing my head by both sides and shaking it)--"don't you want to feel better!!!?" lol yes Lvg, could do counselling tonight. All I can do is keep fighting and hope my brain gets with the program and stops going off script What a process, eh?
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  11. #11
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    Hey GoodDaysAhead, It's definitely a process.. How about a new script, stop fighting.. know that a few off days, just rest roll with it and this too shall pass...as you have alot of clean time and know what to expect accept it, I now believe that stress, anger and feeling like your not in control makes things 10 times worse just know that it time all will be well.. I know easy said.. I have tried everything to find that magic cure..here we go poof....
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  12. #12
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    Here to support you...
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  13. #13
    GoodDaysAhead is offline Member
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    You're right Lvg. I think helping people....to be of service would help a lot at the stage I am right now. Yes, work helps, but it's not being of service to others. Something non profit would be ideal. Helping others who are in need, would not only get me out of my own head in this time, but I would be helping others who are in need. In a year from now--addictions counsellor would be ideal, but something like helping in soup kitchen for the poor would suffice for now. I'm going to look at some options that don't require a lot of schooling for right now.
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  14. #14
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    Hey GoodDaysAhead, Yes..yes...being of service..we become so self centered, helping others so rewarding in many ways...I'm sure UncleLeo can tell you what all here have shared with us. There's nothing we didn't do or try on this journey...be well.. Stay Strong for Today...
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  15. #15
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    Good morning GoodDaysAhead,. Happy Wednesday
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  16. #16
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    How we doing GoodDaysAhead...Have a awesome Thursday... keep smiling.. Stay Strong for Today....
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  17. #17
    GoodDaysAhead is offline Member
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    What a great day yesterday! And another one today! Gotta take the bad with the good, but man, when the good is good....it's darn good
    Hope you have a great day!

  18. #18
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    Hello GoodDaysAhead, yesss...the high high days---low low days.. know them well in fact.. where's the balance eh?. well here I go... I think imo that we were numb for so long that we forgot how life's good and not so good days are you know..now having some clean time we just want to be "normal" we start feeling everything so deeply that when the good days come than go like everyone else we want it all the time...well that's just not everyday life chit happens...life on life's terms...but I think for us we can now deeply appreciate what's in front of us today..so go on with your goofy self enjoy the day....our journey is a process it takes time.. Stay Strong for Today..
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  19. #19
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    Hello GoodDaysAhead, good morning... Keep up the good work the good days just keep coming and coming.. proud of how far you have come. All the hard work you put in gives me and others here Hope that it's possible to be free of those handcuffs and live life clean. Thanks for the inspiration my friend... Stay Strong for Today
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  20. #20
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    Doing a drive by to let you know I am thinking of you...
    Hope all is going well for you Today...
    You are my rock my friend...
    So good to be alive.....

  21. #21
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    Is there a reason why LDN wouldn't have been suggested to the OP for him to research?

    I am genuinely shocked at the lack of conversation regarding LDN in many of the threads especially for someone who suspects EDS. Not blaming, seriously curious. Have people had bad experiences or something? Are they unaware of it?

    Replies and feedback appreciated.

  22. #22
    Autumnhopes is offline Member
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    This thread is about why we used... I know why I have had so much trouble getting clean, my grandfathers death has brought about so much pain but even before all of that grief I've dealt with so many ups and downs in my life and opiates and narcotics are like a stabilizing force a peaceful calming force in my life that helps me to be able to be calm and you feel euphoria and peace that's why I've enjoyed them so much...
    I'm not saying it's an excuse or it's a good thing but right now I don't know how to get out of it I'm just so desperate and it seems like the only thing that's helping me go from day today without giving up completely on life

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