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Jumped from 3 mg
  1. #1
    sore6 is offline Junior Member
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    Default Jumped from 3 mg

    Today is the first day I jump. I could not wait any longer, I was so sit and tired of using a crutch, suboxone brought down my sex drive to 0. I used to like to haves sex 5 times a day before anyone of this started. Granted I was younger and full of testosterone but now I have to force myself to do it and even have to take a Viagra and barely with that I can only finish the job and not always for her. I did not think I would ever have the courage to jump but I did it. On my way to work right now, hope this will keep me busy. At this point I really feel like it is better in life to die on your feet than live on your knees a slave. It feels so weird not to do something that I have been doing everyday for 8 years. But I did it. I want to think positive and really feel it is mostly mental. I will keep everyone posted. Please pray for me.

  2. #2
    sore6 is offline Junior Member
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    A couple of hours later and I getting some cold and hot flashes. I can't take my mind of the suboxone, I feel like I need it. I feel like if I don't have it something is missing. It's like an old friend that I don't want to let go off. I thought being at work will take my mind off it but it isn't. I am even watching reruns of an old show on amazon at work. Had a big breakfast this morning once I got to work and going to lunch in 20 minutes.

  3. #3
    mammaj Guest

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    Wow! Will Def pray for you and your not going to feel a lot different today or tomorrow because subs have a 72 hour half life. But I believe you will hit severe withdrawal soon which really isn't good. I honestly don't recommend it but I'm not a dr. But if you look thru and read the forums you should wean off of it.
    Wishing you the best!

  4. #4
    Ken2727 is offline Senior Member
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    Welcome here sore . I can totally understand being tired of the sub as a crutch and wanting to hurry and be off it . 3mgs is still a strong dose though and it may set you up for a bad withdrawal and even failure this jump . I tried jumping off of 2mgs last spring , twice . Was the wrong answer for me and I wound up back on a much higher dose both times .. As Mammaj mentioned the half life of subs is long so you will probably have worse symptoms really kicking in day 3 . I am not trying to scare you but want you to know what most people experience from all that I've read here . Also I am not saying you can't handle it but I am curious if you have any more sub ? If so are you familiar with Roberts taper plan ? Most people , myself included , taper down to 1/4mg or less before jumping . A wise Lady shared we want to do this once and do It right so I wanted to pass that on . Whatever you decide keep posting here as the people here either have been thru or going thru it . I wish you the best .

    Ken
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  5. #5
    sore6 is offline Junior Member
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    Thank you for your reply. I have plenty of suboxone left. I have enough for 20 days and go to my doctor who will be more than happy to write me another script for 250 dollars all cash and no insurance. At this point I am feeling some withdrawals since I usually numb myself in the morning every day. I will go the taper route if it get too bad. I did this just to see if I can go 1 day without it. I have been using it for 8 years and it is slowly killing me. Can't feel any emotions, no highs and no lows, just numb. So I want to see what I can do without it. I have gone through I opiate withdraws before, It was he'll for 3 days, then I go on subs and have been on ever since. Part of me has no wanted to ever feel this pain again, it is hell on earth. I will keep everyone posted as the hours go by.
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  6. #6
    Sharks fan is offline Advanced Member
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    Sore

    Are you familiar with Robert's taper plan? I will post it just in case you haven't seen it. I understand wanting to be done, but that's a very high dose and you will be sick for awhile. Subs aren't like regular opiates where the worst w/d's pass after the first 3 days.

    https://www.drugs.com/forum/featured...apy-50887.html

    Several of us used this plan and didn't miss work and have very minimal symptoms. We will support you no matter what you decide.
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  7. #7
    iloerose is offline Platinum Member
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    I'm glad Sharks posted the taper plan for you and she's right: you've been on for 8 years AND jumped from a high dose of subs. The benefit of the taper is that it allows your brain and body to slowly mend before you jump. As you taper, you slowly decrease the amount of opiate (subs) in your body. So if you have to jump back on, it's no shame on you. If you decide to go through the w/d, we will support you. You should look at the Thomas Recipe for the c/t. Here are some things that will make you more comfortable:

    Immodium: not only helps with D, but contains a mild opiate that doesn't cross blood/brain barrier and will help you.
    Gatorade: hydration and RLS
    Hyland's Resful Leg or Hyland's Calme's Forte. You can also try some tonic water.
    Stay away from energy drinks, caffeine, soda, and drink OJ, water, and other pure fruit juices.
    For sleep: an OTC or melatonin, sleepy time tea STRONG. or Yogi's Kava tea to relax you.
    EXERCISE: so important in getting your natural endorphines working again. Do whatever you can even if it's a short walk.
    Hot baths, some use epsom salts.
    A good vitamin/mineral supplement. Potassium (RLS). B-12
    For energy try L-tyrosine with B-6 (b-6 helps L-t to metabolize)

    Even if you do decide to taper further from the 3mg., these things will help you. Whatever you decide, support is here.

    Peace,

    Iloerose
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  8. #8
    sore6 is offline Junior Member
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    Oh well, a set up, my mind was on it the whole day, I took a .25mg. I guess I was trying to lie to myself this morning. I think I will die on subxone. It's like my crutch. I was so proud of myself this morning and so determined, I lasted a good 6 hours. Wow I feel like a complete failure. For me it is as mental as it physical. Even though the.25 is not much, I felt so much better the second I put it under my tongue, it's like my body in that second felt great. So I know it is more mental fore than physical. I will see what tomorrow brings.

  9. #9
    sore6 is offline Junior Member
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    Thank you everyone for your support. I can't come clean to my wife to be so I need an out. I feel the forums really help.

  10. #10
    Sharks fan is offline Advanced Member
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    Sore

    You are not a failure. Getting clean is very hard, it's even harder to stay clean. Are you attending meetings? That might also help you with the mental part.

    Did you look at the taper plan I posted? It sounds like you are ready to get off subs, the taper plan will work well for you. If you start taking random doses you run the risk of not being stable and you'll feel even worse.

    The items Rose mentions will help you with your symptoms if you decide to try c/t again.

  11. #11
    alexnt is offline Platinum Member
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    sore if you have been on subs for 8 years you do not want to jump at 3 mg. The longer one is on subs the tougher it is to get off of them. Without going into long details I just read last night an article by a Fla sub Dr who was addicted to fentanyl himself and used subs to get off fent. He detoxes people off of opiates in rather short amounts of time but when it comes to weaning them off of subs after long periods of use he has to do it slowly he stated. From what I gathered if you have been at 3 mg for awhile he would have you go to 2.5 mg for at least a week then if your ok at 2.5 mg after a week go to 2 mg. If you jump at 3 mg my guess is you are going to start suffering bad in 2 or 3 days. My best wishes to you.

    Alex
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  12. #12
    sore6 is offline Junior Member
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    I have jumped again today. Yesterday I caved in at .25 but today my will is stronger. In order for a part of me to live, another part has to die. I have a choice, at any second I can take the subs but if make it just 1 day, 1 day 24 hours, It will be like a won a huge battle, I know I am still facing a battle ahead of me, but I want to feel alive again, I don't want to numb myself Anymore, I want to laugh, I want to cry, I want to feel what it feels like to be human again. Will post soon if this day passes

  13. #13
    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    Hey there. Like everyone already said, you're not weak or a failure. After 8 years, jumping off of 3 mg will be a nightmare. I've taken subs for 7 years and would never attempt a jump like that. You will do just fine if you follow the taper plan.

    Good luck!
    Kat

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    Willpower does not work on substance abuse problems. Having and following a plan and getting support works. Try that, instead of repeating the same thing and expecting different results.
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  15. #15
    iloerose is offline Platinum Member
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    As just about everyone has suggested, and they are very knowledgeable people: You are placing yourself in an impossible situation. You will cave again when the w/d gets bad and then go through that cycle of guilt again, needlessly. You are suffering needlessly. You need a plan: this includes tapering safely off of the sub, while at the same time putting together a support system to help you stay clean. I am not putting you down here, no one is, we are just trying to get you to seek a way to get off of subs in a way that will A) give you time to slowly wean the sub while B) give you time to put together a support to stay clean. When we are getting clean, we think that we will be back to who we were before we started this nightmare as soon as the w/d is over. And that of course the w/d cannot last forever (in your case it's probably going to last longer
    than you think). You are having cravings for the sub because you are ADDICTED to the sub. You need to do this once and do it right and you CAN do this.

    Peace,

    Iloerose

  16. #16
    alexnt is offline Platinum Member
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    sore the thing about subs is the long half life that it has. This example is based on a 36 hour half life which your body might metabolize maybe slower or faster then. I have read it can range anywhere from 20 to 70 hrs and the average is 37 hrs. If you have been taking 3 mg a day for 10 days or longer when you take your 3 mg that day you have at that point about 8 mg of subs in your system. That is why you could skip a whole day and be ok but as time goes by you are going to start feeling worse and worse. I understand you saying you don't want to numb yourself anymore and that is what subs do especially long term use of them. I do not know you personally yet I still do not want you to suffer. After years of being on subs whats a little extra time seeing that you can taper down and not have to go thru total hell. You mention you want to laugh again but I see a lot more crying then laughing ahead for you if you don't wean down

    Alex
    Last edited by Anonymous; 03-14-2014 at 08:28 PM.
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  17. #17
    Sharks fan is offline Advanced Member
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    Sore

    Listen to what everyone is telling you, Rose and Alex know their stuff. No one is here to judge or discourage you from getting clean. The advice you are getting is to taper slowly off subs, by doing that you increase your chances of being successful and lessen your pain and suffering. After 8 years why the big rush? What's another 2 months if it means you can do this without being miserable?

    I can understand reaching the end of your rope, but that's good. Use that as motivation to stick to the plan.

    We will support you whatever you decide, but I think you should reconsider trying to reinvent the wheel. The reason that taper plan is still used is because it works. Give it a chance, I think you will be pleased and you will still be working towards being clean.
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  18. #18
    mammaj Guest

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    I myself am still tapering off the subs. I didn't think I would be successful but have come a long way over the past month. What everyone says here is correct. I wanted off in a rush because I felt like you. But the taper does take a while. When I jump lower in dose the most effects I have from it is a headache a sweating for two days feel better another 2 to 3 days then lower dose again.
    Still thinking of you. Don't traumatize your body and mind. Take it slow.
    Wishing you the best. I myself am still doing taper too.

  19. #19
    HeavyConceious is offline New Member
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    Sore - i would like to wish you the most luck with your 'crutch'.
    I got into pills pretty heavy in 2010 and it progressed into an everyday habit of at-least 30-90mg rox or a opana.. this is my first time opening up on a public forum but i felt that my words might help someone in the future. As you can see I was using the heavier pills and I continued to do so up until last yr.
    I have probably been taking subs for 2-3 yrs also, but from the beginning I had done my research and knew what I was getting myself into with the subs. IN hindsight I wish I would of went about things differently because I begun needing that sub 'crutch'. I read about the half life of the bupe/nax or which ever it is and knew the longer that I was on these, the more I was extending the situation.
    A good point for me to make is that my doses were never full 8mgs, I only would dose enough to take the rls/hot flashes and to be able to sleep at night. I would alternate from mornings to night doses, figuring which way I got a nicer rest. I probably have been dosing <1mg for the past 1.5yr.

    Fast forward Christmas this year I purchased my last three strips I would be able to get, which lasted until the end of jan. The lady was giving me the run around and it was just a hassle having to worry about if they were hard up and sold the ones i needed, ect ect. I got a subetex 1st week of feb i think, i was able to get one more generic suboxone that I still have. The end of the subutex was on 3/4 so i am currently on day 11.

    I recall reading somewhere that opiates take 4-6weeks to fully experience freedom from the physical withdrawls. I plan on making some entrys into a personal journal so i know what i went through, not to do again.
    I can tell you that the craps... hot/cold flashes... phantom pains in the legs/arms (RLS) is no cupcake. I had managed to get probably 1 hr totals worth of sleep the first 5-7 days, now at day eleveen i got a good nights rest last night, and the night before. I hope that sleep continues in the fashion that it is.

    I have a lot of friends who are on subs 'maintence' and i wonder, what would happen if something happened and no more subs? YOU are strong, mentally! I can tell you that my head is clearer and clearer every day and it feels great to know I am finally taking care of something that has been on my mind for awhile. You are not alone in this fight! I know I am not out of the woods either but in my mind I know I do not wish this upon myself, or my worst enemy. IT IS POSSIBLE THO I AM HERE TO ATTEST.

    I have the oppurtunity to take benzos for the sleep but i chose not to. I only take my prescribed meds for my gerd/stomach issues, which helped a lot w/ the upset stomach, but still stomach was bloated and in knots. I FEEL stronger every day.

    Try to get outside, go on walks, join a gym, exercise. KNOW that your body did not need this everyday before to function and that you CAN continue on without it.

    GOOD Luck
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  20. #20
    sore6 is offline Junior Member
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    Thank you all for your support, this is amazing how people want to help. The withdrawals did hit like a ton of bricks, I am now doing a taper plan, everyone is right, 8 years so what is another 2 months? I will do it the correct way, for some reason I thought there was no difference between .25 or 8 mg. I convinced myself that the dose does not matter for subs, I told myself that.25 is as strong as 8mg. I think it was very cloudy judgement to do so, I wanted to get clean in a week before my wife to be returns from her business trip. I was wrong, I will do it right. I will keep everyone posted. God, i want to get down on my knees and cry but crying will not make this better.
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  21. #21
    iloerose is offline Platinum Member
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    Look on the bright side of things: you will not be a mess when your wife to be returns. Not meaning to be funny, but it will be much easier to come off tapering and with a softer landing. There is no reason to believe that you will have bad w/d coming off of these. There is a vast distance between 8mg. and .25mg. The safest thing for you to do is to return to your taper. You may even decide to re-induct at 2mg. rather than 3mg. The thing with a sub taper like yours (being on them for so long) is that slow and steady will win the race for you. Read Ken's thread. He's been on long term, and come off them easily doing a taper. He was all over the place with his sub dosing when he started and now he's off. Just remember that you didn't get here overnight and you will be much more likely to succeed kicking these using the taper. Please keep posting and journal your experience here. This is a good thread for people to read and not because you've been unsuccessful, I don't view you as being unsuccessful, misled about subs maybe, but your thread will be good instruction for those following behind you.

    Peace,

    Iloerose
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  22. #22
    Sharks fan is offline Advanced Member
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    Sore

    I'm glad you decided to do the taper, I agree with Rose, it's much safer. You may have to stay on a dose a little longer than 4 days. Just listen to your body, if you don't feel stable don't drop. If you do that, I think you will be ok. Just remember that if you do this right you will be free.

    Keep posting here, use this a journal.
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  23. #23
    sore6 is offline Junior Member
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    So interesting, ever since I dropped the dosage and I don't mean to offend anyone but I wake up hard in the mornings. That has not happened to me in 12 years, and it's not like I just shot myself with a testosterone shot. Opiads kill the sex drive. That's another huge reason why I want out so bad. While on opioids and subs I had to force myself to get in the mood, it was like a chore, it never was like that before opiades.

  24. #24
    Sharks fan is offline Advanced Member
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    Sore

    As you taper you will feel better and more like your old self. I started to feel MUCH better when I got under 2 mg. Subs are powerful and even 3mg is a pretty high dose.

    For me 1.75-1 mg wasn't bad, I felt good and I woke up with energy. Everything under 1mg was a little tougher, but it wasn't that bad. I never missed work, I was tired and felt totally unmotivated.

  25. #25
    mammaj Guest

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    I am right there with you Sore.
    Haven't felt anything as far as emotions until I got low in my taper. Sleep came better I felt so much better going lower & lower and because of taking it slow I have had very minimal effects. Mild sweating and hot flashes but no cravings either.
    Take a vitamin B complex and will help with energy and because I'm being treated for pain and oxycodone addiction I have been taking motrin & Tylenol. I have bad back issues lot of damage and aging take its toll. Exercise helps the pain if that is your case.
    I wish you the best as always.
    Talk to your wife I suggest. I don't know your circumstances so sometimes you'll be surprised how supportive they are. My husband was amazing. Talk to social worker's I have 2 I speak with. They are wonderful. It does help to speak out with someone who's non judging. They listen and make suggestions just like being on this forum. But we are non professionals can only advise as far as our own experience and others on here.
    Stay in tap with a professional. That way if anything happens with w/d symptoms that don't feel right you have a pro knowing your background and story
    Have a great day!!

  26. #26
    sore6 is offline Junior Member
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    I feel like such an idiot for not looking into when the doc started at 24 mg a day 8 years ago. I mean looking back at it, I am shaking my head. He told me I should be on them for life, sure 250 dollars a month for him in cash for life would be nice. That is just 1 patient and I know he sees at least 50. What am unethical doctor. But I don't blame anyone but myself for getting myself into this mess.

  27. #27
    mammaj Guest

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    Don't... your not one at all. From what I'm reading a lot of people here have hard times with their dr.
    It's sad when you can't communicate with them. But I do know all to we'll how that us. I found a dr last fall totally by accident. Went in on a Saturday for a emergency visit and met her. I can talk to her about anything. She doesn't even care if I smoke herb once in a blue moon. She knows it helps with my pain and a lot of other issues going on.
    Keep looking one day you will find one who truly cares.
    Took me a very long time. Other than my pediatrician I didn't really care for any of my PCPs till I met dr Maya H.

  28. #28
    sore6 is offline Junior Member
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    What nationality is she ? I know a couple of middle eastern doctors with that name.

  29. #29
    mammaj Guest

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    I'm not sure she has no accent. And just the average woman in her 40 s...

  30. #30
    sore6 is offline Junior Member
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    If anyone is following me, I weened myself down to .5, I think I am stable on it, want to stay on it a couple more days then take it down to .25 then to .125 then jump. I wish they made bigger films so that when you take .25 it is as long as a 2mg that way you feel like you are taking something you fool your mind. It gets hard to cut them past .50 at that point it is like you are taking nothing. I think the company does that on purpose to keep people hooked on them.
    I think they should be required by law to produce .125 strips that are as long as the 2mg strip.

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