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Making the plan :) please help me
  1. #1
    J_addict is offline New Member
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    Default Making the plan :) please help me

    Hello everyone.
    I posted a thread awhile back and dudbt receive much support or advice so I continued to abuse my suboxone prescription. I recently got married and have always wanted to be a mother! I REFUSE to bring a child into this world while still on this junk. Not judging anyone who has children while on subs I just want to remove it from my life before trying to conceive/ for my own beliefs and reasoning. I'm prescribed 12mg a day but I take anywhere from 16-30mg depending on my mood that day :/ I know aweful. Your probably wondering how I dont run out? I do run out every month and spend $200+ a month on extras.. I'm so sick of this and want to stop this madness! I've been reading posts here for hours now and saw roberts taper 25% reduction .. I'm going to start tomorrow getting stable at my prescribed dose of 12mg and work off that! Any advice or support is greatly appreciated I've been doing this for 7years mind you so this is not going to be an easy task but I'm determined and have hope from all of you that this can happen for me and I can finally become a mom!!
    Jenn

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    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    Hi Jenn,

    Welcome back! Glad to see you want off the Sub train. I just completed my taper last month. Including the time it took to taper off, I was on Sub for almost 8 years. So, it's totally possible to get off this junk after long term use.

    If you've been taking between 16-30 mg per day, you'll probably need to stabilize at a dose higher than 12 mg. Your body is used to much higher doses, so you'll need to figure out "where" you're stable. How long have you been taking 16-30 mg?

    Also, since you've been on Sub for 7 years, you need to taper much slower than every 4 days. The "every 4 day" rule is for people who are new to Sub or have only been on it for a short time. I had to wait 2 weeks between every reduction. I know that it will make your taper longer, but it's the only way to be comfortable while tapering. I'm not saying you'll need 2 weeks like me. At first, it'll be trial and error, so to speak. Once you're stable at your starting dose (whatever that may be), you can make your first 25% reduction and see how long it takes you to stabilize again.

    You can do this! A proper taper takes time and patience. Glad to see you back!
    Kat
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  3. #3
    Randy35 is offline Platinum Member
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    In all honesty you could reduce your dose to 8mg beginning tomorrow and you wouldn't even notice the difference. If you think you do is gonna be a mental thing with your brain messing with you. Get completely stable for at LEAST 4 days on the 8mg dose as per Robert's plan then reduce by 25% nd keep repeating that process until you're down to around .25mg or so.

    Seven years is a long time on subs so take your time, it's no race at this point. If you follow the plan you should get off with minimal symptoms. The time will go faster than you think and you will have plenty of support here to keep you going.

    Get a bank and put that extra $200 in it each month and before you know it you will have a nice tidy sum built up to get yourself a nice reward. If you want to start at 12mg that's perfectly ok too. Up to you to take that first step by reducing the dose. You can do this!
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    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    Randy suggested dropping to 8 mg immediately. While I agree that 8 mg is a high dose and you may be able to stabilize there, you also may not. If you can, that's great! The reason I suggested trying to stabilize at a higher dose is because you've got a hell of a lot of Sub built up in your system from taking up to 30 mgs.

    Do what you feel you can handle. If you wanna try to stabilize at 8 or 12, go for it! The worst thing that could happen is that you don't feel well and need to increase it a little. No biggie.

    We're here to help! Talk soon.
    Kat
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  5. #5
    jp23 is offline New Member
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    I agree with randy that you should try 8mg. It may not be enough right now depending on how often you're going 16+mg, but try 8 in the morning and see how you feel for a few hours, you can always take more if you start to get sick. Tapering down isn't fun, but it's totally doable. You just need to be mentally prepared to not get high and only stay well. Thats how I did it and now I'm on the end of day 4 with no subs. Good luck and be strong
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  6. #6
    J_addict is offline New Member
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    Thank you all very much for the replys. I was reading posts for hours before posting and now I'm so grateful I did. Make no mistake that 'junk' thou has significantly made my life better over these 7yrs. I work 2 jobs while going to college for my nursing degree & just had the wedding of my dreams to the man of my dreams. I was a hopeless dope fiend felon who dropped out of high school in 9th grade. This all came to light recently when my husband (who is on subs too- weaning off 1-2mg) suggested we both get off before having children. Then I go to my normal sub appt today and my dr said your very stable & have a busy life maybe you should start weaning before you get pregoo. The signs were all there and the willingness that came over me today was inspiring! although my life is stable through subs & the NA program I've beeb abusing them way too long honestly it does nothing to me when I take more - I take more until I feel a numbness / I know its all in my head it's sad. I have not been on a stable dose in over 5yrs - I take random doses daily. My goal is to this week get at a stable dose of prob 12mg because my head will convince me otherwise prob. I'm prescribed 12mg so ill going to try just 12mg for the next 3days and see what happens ? IM not going to tell my dr yet because I fear they'll cut my dose and I need to feel I can do this first- having what I have- I filled my script today!!
    You guys have given me hope in just your short postings that I can do this and you guys will be here to support me through this! This is huge for me - I've been comfortable with how I've been living up until now. I want more though thank you guys. I'm going to bed now - sorry for the ramble I'm just excited about what the future may hold!
    I'm going to start 12mg ONLY tomorrow I'll let u know how it goes!!!
    Xoxo
    Jenn
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  7. #7
    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by J_addict View Post
    Thank you all very much for the replys. I was reading posts for hours before posting and now I'm so grateful I did. Make no mistake that 'junk' thou has significantly made my life better over these 7yrs. I work 2 jobs while going to college for my nursing degree & just had the wedding of my dreams to the man of my dreams. I was a hopeless dope fiend felon who dropped out of high school in 9th grade. This all came to light recently when my husband (who is on subs too- weaning off 1-2mg) suggested we both get off before having children. Then I go to my normal sub appt today and my dr said your very stable & have a busy life maybe you should start weaning before you get pregoo. The signs were all there and the willingness that came over me today was inspiring! although my life is stable through subs & the NA program I've beeb abusing them way too long honestly it does nothing to me when I take more - I take more until I feel a numbness / I know its all in my head it's sad. I have not been on a stable dose in over 5yrs - I take random doses daily. My goal is to this week get at a stable dose of prob 12mg because my head will convince me otherwise prob. I'm prescribed 12mg so ill going to try just 12mg for the next 3days and see what happens ? IM not going to tell my dr yet because I fear they'll cut my dose and I need to feel I can do this first- having what I have- I filled my script today!!
    You guys have given me hope in just your short postings that I can do this and you guys will be here to support me through this! This is huge for me - I've been comfortable with how I've been living up until now. I want more though thank you guys. I'm going to bed now - sorry for the ramble I'm just excited about what the future may hold!
    I'm going to start 12mg ONLY tomorrow I'll let u know how it goes!!!
    Xoxo
    Jenn
    Hey Jenn...

    Sounds like a plan! Give yourself at least 4 full days to see how you feel. Sub has a crazy long half-life, so if problems/symptoms are going to crop up, it won't happen right away. Hopefully, there won't be any symptoms!

    Glad you're on board. I'll check in with you tomorrow.
    Kat
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    Randy35 is offline Platinum Member
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    Jenn - Glad to hear you want to get off the sub after so long. Just an FYI for you and Kat, but the reason I suggested you could reduce to 8mgs without any problems is the fact you HAVE been taking such high doses for so long that you have one HUGE build up of sub in your system. You could probably go days without taking any sub and be ok, but don't do that. Just wanted to explain my suggestion a little further.

    Your plan to ONLY take 12 mg per day is great! Try to take it at the same time each day to keep a steady amount of bupe in you system at all times. Your head is gonna mess with you at first wanting you to take more as you usually have been doing. Stay strong and fight back any urges to take more.

    Like Kat suggested - give it a full 4 days on the 12 mg and see how you feel. If you feel good and are stable then reduce by 25% like the plan suggests which would make the next dose 9mg per day. Then it's only a matter of repeating the process and you'll be down to tiny doses before you know it!! Be proud of yourself for taking the first step!!! Good job!!!
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    KSinMT is offline Member
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    Hello. A few months ago I was just like you and was taking way more than I needed, between 16-20 mg a day, at random times when I would feel like >>>> I would just take more. I also would run out early at times and stress out over "am I going to be able to find more?", etc. I am prescribed 8 mg a day but I was getting am extra 30+ pills a month from another source. Well that source was abruptly cut off a few months ago so I had no choice but to seip down to 8 mg a day- over a 50% drop from what I was used to taking on most days, and I have to tell you IT WAS NOT THAT BAD and I honestly hardly felt a thing and I even felt BETTER on the lower dose. I had my mind convinced for so long that I needed the higher doses and when I didn't have that much to take, I thought it was then end of the world which was so not true and just my addict mind playing games. After I realized I was not going to die because I didn't have my huge dose of sub, I decided to taper off once and for all. The pros of tapering off, far outweigh the cons for me at this point. I've been on 6 yrs. I'm down to 5 mg a day now and feel fine. It's a mental battle and you have to psych yourself up for it and convince yourself you will be so much better off without it. Take care!
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    J_addict is offline New Member
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    Hi guys thank you for all your advice & incouragement. Oddly enough I take my dose at night well late afternoon, so I'm about to try to take the only 12mg today without convincing myself I need more. I'm also going to start leaving them at home- I usually carry them with me so I tend to take them whenever I feel. Mostly none other reason then to take more/ chasing something that isn't even there. When I got up this morning I felt alil anxiety knowing today I would take the prescribed dose which I've never taken correctly. You are so right though I need to pych myself up to do this because I can already hear my disease trying to convince me this isn't a good idea. I feel let you all know how I feel later after a few hours of dosing.
    Randy- you mentioned how I prob could skip a few days having that much in my system. Weird thing is - because I've been on it for so many years (never missed a day ever!) my body knows it like clockwork - come 3-4pm I start getting anxious and the yawns with watery eyes? Not sure if that's possible but my body seems to know exactly 24hrs and wants more. Weird. I mean I've never tried with the minimal effects as soon as I yawn I dose so? I'm interested to see what is going to happen! I'll keep you guys posted- thanks a bunch!
    Xoxo
    Jenn

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    J_addict is offline New Member
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    So I did it! Woot Woot! I only took the 12mg yesterday around 3pm. It was tuff though my head was doing for a good 5hrs, didn't sleep that well, and woke up kind of weak. But def nothing I can't handle I'm going to do it again today & over the weekend with 12mg to really get regulated on a set dose in my body since it's not use to this. Monday I'm going to start on 8mg. Wish me luck
    Ps I had class last night & left them at home which helped huge. I kept busy and by the time I got home I had forgotten about it

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    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    Hey there...

    Just checking in. How's it going? Hope you had a good day.
    Kat

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    Iluv2smile is offline Platinum Member
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    Cool

    Welcome
    I used to do that with the methadone I was on .. It cost me hundreds of dollars extra every month..
    I follow ksin's thread and Kat's too..
    Please join us we are all in this together..
    Kat already off 30+ days and she has great tips ,.
    She said " just take your dose and forget it". What a concept
    I take my vitamins 1 time a day and don't think about them again till the next day..

    So that is my suggestion for you too.. Take it and forget about it..
    Maybe put it will any other meds you take 1 time a day.
    It is definitely mental and the lower the dose the more mental it becomes.
    Sub is a strange drug..
    Less is more..
    Congratulations on your decision!
    Take care
    Will talk to you later,

    Iluv

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    bg1007 is offline Member
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    Congrats on your choice to taper off subs!! It can feel like a long road but very doable and so rewarding in the end!! Today is my 34th day off subs after around 6 years on them and over 4 years of abusing hard drugs before that and I feel pretty great and I truly believe that my spending almost a year tapering down to .25 mg played a big role in the final jump not being as terrible as I had imagined it to be. The mental battle is half the challenge but it's amazing how we find strength when we need it most! I never thought I'd see this day and for me this has been one of the biggest accomplishments so far in my life. I also wanted to get off the subs before having children one day as a personal goal and hope of mine and I feel very proud of myself. I do get some cravings still here and there but they never overpower my desire to stay free of this stuff so far Like Kat and Randy said, take your time with the taper as there is no rush to the finish line. Slow and steady always wins the race right!
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    Iluv2smile is offline Platinum Member
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    Hi there J

    How are you doing?
    Please drop in and let us know..
    Talk to you soon,
    Iluv2

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    J_addict is offline New Member
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    Hi guys I'm frigin struggling I need support

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    Randy35 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by J_addict View Post
    Hi guys I'm frigin struggling ������ I need support
    Hey Jenn - What seems to be the problem? Are you still on the 12mg dose? Give ua a bit more info and how we can help?

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    J_addict is offline New Member
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    I did do the 12mg for a few days then went back to taking it however bought more then I needed. I don't wanna keep doing this- I know it's mental and I have to get over the hump . I felt like I did good for a few days on the 12 then of course the person I buy extra from called and I got them. Ugh

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    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    Jenn,

    I saw the new thread you started this morning. Stick to this thread - it will be much easier for us to find you and follow up. More than one thread gets confusing.

    I have an appt this morning but will check back when I get home. All I can say for now is you have to really WANT this. You have to put forth the effort. Eliminate the "other source" be any means necessary.

    Talk to you soon.
    Kat
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  20. #20
    Randy35 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by J_addict View Post
    I did do the 12mg for a few days then went back to taking it however bought more then I needed. I don't wanna keep doing this- I know it's mental and I have to get over the hump . I felt like I did good for a few days on the 12 then of course the person I buy extra from called and I got them. Ugh
    Jenn - You have to make a BIG decision.
    Either continue to ABUSE the subs and waste HUGE amounts of money OR
    Change your entire outlook on life and do the right thing.

    You've been on subs for 7 years you said - this has to STOP!!!

    You run out early of your prescribed dose of 12mg every month and then buy extras. WOW!

    You said you wanted to be a mother, but didn't want to be on subs doing it. You know what you have to do. Taking 16 - 30mg of subs UNNECESSARILY a day is ridiculous. You are building a TOLERANCE to a powerful drug so high it's unbelievable. This has to stop Jenn.

    Make a stand NOW! TODAY!!! Do it for YOU first, and your family second. Have to get your thinking straight girl. Have to want it more than anything else. Get rid of ALL contacts to more subs. Tell your contact to NEVER sell you subs again. Delete all numbers to dealers. Stay on 12 per day ONLY until your thinking changes. But not too long. NO EXTRA SUBS A DAY!!!

    You have so much sub built up in your system it's crazy! Have to change things.

    Remain on 12mg per day for a few days then reduce by 25%. You have to get your dose down. There is NO reason for being where you are. Do this thing for YOU Jenn. Here to help.
    Last edited by Anonymous; 10-15-2014 at 11:35 AM.
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    That's great! I'm glad to hear of your plan. I'm also a nurse and former high school drop out. I'm not currently working bc I know I can't, Dr said no to working as a RN currently too. You can do this! I got myself to 4mg in a Few weeks from 16mg! This has been a 5yr battle for me between Rx pills and Rx subs for pain management, but it's doable. I feel fine tapering so tomorrow I go to 3mg for a week. I'd suggest you go by 7days min at each reduction, listen to your body. You know what you can handle and can't! Congratulations on your wedding and wanting to be a mommy! I'm a mommy too, my daughter us almost 9 now! We're all here to support and help you every step of the way and you just made the biggest step of all...taking action and wanting to go off! Be proud if yourself, you can do it! Xoxoxox-R
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  22. #22
    J_addict is offline New Member
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    Thank you so much- all of you. I do want this but how bad? I mean it is a constant battle in my head daily I want to end this craziness / then my head says but your doing so good lol! I have gotten my life back due to subs because I have not shot dope in 7yrs.- the most aweful if when I take more it does nothing / I'm always chasing something that is not there . It's sad. I need to do this this time - deleting the numbers - keeping a journal and talking to you guys daily. You have no idea how much even the support and encouragement means - because no one knows what I'm doing its my hidden life. But something needs to change - 12mg today that is it- luckily the person I get more from which I would of today can't give me any so I said good ok bye here's the true test if I make it this week on the 12mg I haven't done the full week yet.

  23. #23
    MrJones is offline Member
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    Jenn, it’s a tremendous step just getting this far in the first place, so you should be proud of that. But...like Randy and others have said, you HAVE to want it. You have to want it more than anything else in life. And it’s likely that it’s not being clean that you want, but the outcome you hope to achieve from it. If you can see the life you can have in your mind’s eye when (not if) all of this is behind you, in fine detail, and that is your ultimate goal in life, then every day you can remind yourself what this sacrifice is for.

    Whether it’s a better life for your children, a professional aspiration, or whatever, if that desire is more powerful than the pain of wd or the psychological pain of regret from never knowing what could have been, then you will be willing to endure whatever it takes to achieve it. I really wish you the best of luck. I know it’s hard.

    I look at it like this; winning is a habit, a small victory every day becomes a giant victory in the end. For me, the worst is still yet to come, but I feel like I have the best chance of quitting permanently now than I ever have, just because for the first time in a long time, I know exactly what I want and when I want it and can see myself on the other side, triumphant in the face of overwhelming challenges.

    Btw, I felt like cr@p today, but writing this has psyched me up again. So thank you. I guess I just need to keep reminding myself that like a lion that doesn't attack an injured prey, it’s the hunt that we should hunger for, the grind, not the meal.

    I really hope this helps you out.
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  24. #24
    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    As addicts, we move on to recovery once we've truly had enough. So, the question is, have you had enough of the secrets, the shame, the guilt, the constant chasing, the sadness, the lies, and feeling like you're just going through the motions of living life rather than actually living it? When the fear of continuing to use outweighs the fear of stopping, that's when you'll know you're really ready to leave that lifestyle behind for good.

    Stay at 12 mg. That is such a high dose already. If you keep putting more and more Sub in your body, there's gonna be real trouble. Once you're stable at 12 mg, make your first 25% drop.

    There's one thing that has made my recovery a success so far: AA/NA meetings. I used to scoff at the idea of being involved and having a sponsor, but it has made all the difference in the world. Please consider it.

    Kat

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    J_addict is offline New Member
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    Mr jones that was awesome I def needed that - thank you. My eye is on the prize which is starting my own new family and I do not want to do that while on subs. I hope that you have a great day as well and I'm grateful my post helped you too!

    Kat- I am sick of it so sick but the disease is so cunning and powerful that one weak moment and I let it win ! I have to stay strong - hold out- keep moving forward. I do have my husbands support as he is tapering too on his own he only takes 1mg if that and is just scared to make the jump, he's been on lesser than me since day on and he doesn't know I abuse mine or buy extras. Yes sick of the lying too Iam very involed in na and even 'sponsor' others kind of but no one knows I'm on subs so it's very hard

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    KSinMT is offline Member
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    J_addict, I wrote a response to you on my thread that you posted on..just wanted to make sure you see it..

  27. #27
    Iluv2smile is offline Platinum Member
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    Hi there!
    We are as sick as our secrets !
    As long as you keep secrets you will continue to abuse the sub and not work on a taper!
    The guilt is to strong!
    Once you know something is wrong like lying to your husband and lying to your sponsees and especially lying to yourself .
    It is over you can't be dishonest in one part of your life and be honest in another part of your life..
    Recovery doesn't work that way!

    I am a RN too..
    This disease doesn't get easier to recover from once you get your license!

    It never gets better it may not happen right away but you will have assess to narcotics and if you are still living in the disease you will abuse your position as a nurse,
    I see it all the time..
    People say I would never do that!
    Never say never!

    I am not trying to make you mad ...I am trying to help you save your life!

    It is your choice ! Now that you are not strung out and you have options and support, people who have been in your shoes or are in those shoes right now and doing it!
    There is no excuse!

    You now know the physiology of the brain there is no way possible to get that first high again!
    You will never have the amount of dopamine stored in your receptors that you did the first time you got high!
    But we all chase that high for years!
    For what?
    Now you have your whole life ahead of you ..
    Your profession ....Nursing is the best profession in the world..
    Your husband your children you want to have!
    If you are on opiates and have kids never mind the guilt you may have but you will miss the most important things about having kids..
    The joy, the laughs, the feelings ! They are amazing and your kids will watch you and do as you do.
    When they see you numb they will think something is wrong with them when they start recognizing the difference in you and them!
    Because they do laugh and smile and cry and live one day at a time and bring more joy than anything to us!

    Please just give this taper a go . Do it for a month see how much better you will feel and how proud you will be of yourself..
    I always say you can always go back .
    There will always be a sub doctor or dealer around the block..just waiting!

    This disease is cunning and baffling but don't use that as an excuse!
    Because you are stronger and more capable than it and you can do it ...if only for today!
    Those days will add up and you will look back just as we all did and say"what was I so afraid of and why did I wait so long"?
    Time flies by with or without you!
    You mize we'll be participating in it instead of looking at it from a distance!

    Please keep posting!
    Let us help each other!
    There are a lot nurses right here to help you go where we have been!
    Take care!
    Iluv2

  28. #28
    MrJones is offline Member
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    wow, Iluv2 was spot on! Regret has been one of the hardest things I've had to face through my taper. Where would we be if I'd done this a decade ago? Now the question is where will we be a decade from now? You can't go back and erase what you've done, but keep telling yourself "this is my time, my moment!" Set the bar higher than you think you can ever reach.

    "It's the repetition of affirmations that leads to belief. And once that belief becomes a deep conviction, things begin to happen...I am the greatest, I said that even before I knew I was." - Muhammad Ali
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  29. #29
    J_addict is offline New Member
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    Hi guys so I been ok these last 2 days. I've only taken the 12mg each day yesterday was kind of tuff I felt like my body was fighting something off? I could of caught something too I don't know. I was sweaty and weak all day and woke up last night soaked with sweat. I slept good though and today I feel much better - I dose at nighttime and it didn't make me feel much better last night so Im thinking I did get sick or something. But today is a brand new day and im keeping my attitude positive I can do this. I'm going to do the whole week on 12mg because my dose hasn't been regular for over 5yrs. If I'm good by next Wednesday im jumping to 8mg .

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    KSinMT is offline Member
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    Good for you Jenn! You can do this. Stay strong and remind yourself that the discomfort and mental stuff is only temporary! You WILL adjust! The only thing I would maybe re-think for you is dropping down to 8mg from 12. Most likely, you wouldn't feel much physically but I think you are a lot like me, and mostly struggle with the mental aspect. Although, I dropped from 16-20 mg down to 8 with no real issues, but I was basically forced to. Since then though, I've had to take baby steps as the bigger drops, even 25%, are a bit too overwhelming. Maybe 9 or 10 mg would be better for you since 8 is more than 25% (9 mg would be an even 25% drop) so you could do 9 or 10mg for a week and then go to 8? I'm sure others will weigh in with their advice but I'd just hate to see you get ahead of yourself and then have that backfire. Remember, if you need to take things one hour at a time...if you feel the urge to take more, put it off for an hour, and then another hour, and so on until the urge passes.
    Iwantoff2013 likes this.

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