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Need Help Starting Suboxone or Methadone Detox
  1. #1
    JoshC2001 is offline New Member
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    Default Need Help Starting Suboxone or Methadone Detox

    I've been lurking around for some time and have finally decided to join and seek help. A little background on me was that I started using OC 80s recreationally and then moved onto Roxy 30s when they changed the OC 80 composition. I was insufflating these for about a year and a half and got up to about 10-15 a day and then made the jump to H. I would use a East Coast bags on a daily basis for another two years insufflating about 10-20 bags or 2 bundles a day before moving over to shooting. No I have been shooting H for 2 years about 20-30 bags a day at my highest and now I'm down to about 10 or 1 bun a day. I can can move from about 7-10 a day without major withdrawl symptom. Now I need to get off once and for all. I have 10 suboxone 8 mg strips and 35 10 mg methadone pills at my disposal. I tried using suboxone twice to get off and always had a rotten 5-6 hours of precipitated withdrawls when I started even if I waited over 24 hours and was in withdrawl. They worked for withdrawl symptoms, but I always gave up about 5 days later because I could not fall asleep until about 8 am and at that point but would only be for about two hours. The RLS and insomnia alwsys made me give in. I know everyone hates methadone, but the third time I tried to detox I tried it because I hated the precipitated withdrawl. I stabilized at 30mg which I thought was good for using 10 bags a day, but gave in again after 3 days because of the restless legs and insomnia. This time I want to do things right. I'm flying out to Alaska tomorrow until Thursday and thinking would be a great time to start bum going to do the last of what I have before I board my plane tomorrow at 6. I have a trip to Prague coming up on May 8th and want to enjoy myself on it and am ready to do this once and for all. Is there anyway that I could use the 80 mg of suboxone I have and be done with this by my trip on May 8? I always go into precipitated withdrawl and I know everyone hates it, but is there anyway I could use the methadone instead? Any help would be appreciated. Definitely have to start tomorrow because my first trip is coming up and won't have access to any H or other opiates which is great for inducing. I know Robert is an expert and if he's around, would love his input. Prefer using methadone to not have tge precipitated withdrawls but I know everyone will probably say no. Any help is appreciated! Thank you in advance. -Josh

  2. #2
    iloerose is offline Platinum Member
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    I don't know how to help you. Methadone is usually used for maintenance, and I know nothing about using it for a short amount of time to kick H w/d. The suboxone you have is not enough to do a decent enough taper to avoid w/d. When you took the subs before you most likely started way too soon and thus ended up with the precipitated w/d. You have to be in moderate to severe w/d before you induct, at least score a 26 on the COWS worksheet, the amount of time isn't significant: what is significant is the degree to which you are in w/d working out the opiate. You really should seek a sub doc to do this properly, to ensure you have enough sub to do the taper. The insomnia and the RLS are often a problem, but should not be as bad if you are using the subs correctly. I'm going to post the sub taper here, but if you really want off you are going to have to ready to tough out some of the hurdles you are most likely to encounter, I mean want to be clean that badly. Here is Robert's recommended taper. Read the induction carefully:

    https://www.drugs.com/forum/featured...apy-50887.html

    If you are going to induct on subs, which I recommend over the methadone, make sure you are at at least a 26 on the COWS (clinical opioid withdrawal scale). You can google a worksheet: start when the w/d first appears and you will put yourself in precipitated w/d. When you begin, because you're habit is so large, I'd start at 2mg. and then wait an hour and take another 1mg., you can repeat either at .5mg or add 1mg. until you feel "normal". You may have to adjust this dose over a few days (induction process), but the idea is to stabilize at the lowest effective dose. Cut your subs first, you can find a video by Harry Smooth, or you can find an image of the cuts by googling "cutting suboxone strips".

    Wish you well, others may have good advice for you as well.

    Peace,

    Iloerose
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  3. #3
    jayryan is offline Member
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    Rose gave you some good advice....
    myself i went from a pretty nasty IV Hroin habit to suboxone myself...
    i don't think its even possible to feel good initially on suboxone even with seroius withdrawals before inducing...

    h is just so strong IV grams of the stuf... however after a week or two on the subs you should feel a little better....that was my experience years ago....
    anyways methadone is pretty nasty stuff...i would try the suboxone rout...but i dunno everyone is different....

    banging dope is a VERy seroius addiction I'm sure you know....

    its possible to quit and bury that demon... i dunno... i would say you need more time then outlined in your post....
    i decided to quit dope four years ago and am just now about to be off subs after a long taper and many relapse and whatnot...

    wish i had better advice....but if you can get on subs and then taper people here will help you including myself...best of luck to you no matter wat you decide to do...peace jay

  4. #4
    jayryan is offline Member
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    Sry..double post
    Last edited by Anonymous; 04-20-2014 at 08:48 PM.

  5. #5
    JoshC2001 is offline New Member
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    Thank you for your advice. If like to give the sub another go and induce properly. Any help at inducing would be greatly appreciated. I fly out tomorrow at 6EST and will then be on Anchorage time after about a ten hour flight. I would abstain starting now, but don't want to induce on the flight so as sad is it is to admit, I will have my last "use" at 4pm EST before I head to the airport. I'm ready to do this and if the RLS is something I have to deal with then I will power through. I gave up in the past because I didn't think it was working correctly. As for starting at the proper time, that is where I get the most anxious and nervous...

  6. #6
    jayryan is offline Member
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    Its possible man...your gonna feel icky at first...ther really ain't no way around that... the trick is to wait as long as possible since your last dose of H.. I would say at least 24 hours if you can make it that long.... just wait until.your in pretty good withdrawals and then take 2mg at a time every few hours till u feel ok...
    normally i don't give induction advice but if no one else is around and you are leaving soon...that's my advice.....

    after a few days you will be ok... but the transition you gotta be sick first ya know.....
    hopefully someone else can help you and tell you excactly how...
    I'm just telling you how i did it.....waited till is was dope sick then ate suboxone probably 8 mg or 16 the first say cause i was trying to feel good on it and it just don't work that way...

    anyways I'm not an expert at all...but you have a few hour....to figure it out...

    i do think the suboxone rout is better...

    Hope that helps some...jay

  7. #7
    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    Hi Josh, welcome. You've come to a great forum.

    Like Rose said, you MUST score at least a 26 on the COWS worksheet before taking subs. That part is extremely important. As you know, taking subs too soon will result in precipitated WD...the worst! I've been through that, once back in 2006. It was absolutely awful.

    Have you seen the COWS worksheet? You can google it. Also, did you read Robert's taper plan that Rose linked to you? I agree with Rose: start with 2 mg subs (instead of .5 mg like the plan recommends). Then, wait at least an hour and add 1 mg every hour until you feel "normal"...which means until most of your WD symptoms have subsided.

    You need to get more subs via a doctor or otherwise. Subs are a great tool to get off opiates. It allows you time to start getting your life in order without the use of drugs.

    You can do this. Countless people have used Robert's taper plan to successfully get off subs. Many of us are currently tapering, myself included. I'm down to .75 mg.

    Talk to you soon,
    Kat
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  8. #8
    jayryan is offline Member
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    Hey my bad...i thought your flight was at six am
    ..didn't realize it not till later...
    i didn't know about the COWS worksheet..but sounds legit....also i agree with kat and rose.. that .5 mg subs ain't gonna even touch withdrawals from H start with atleast 2mg... you can go up to 8 (any higher is mainly a cealing effect or something....
    anyways the idea is to take the least amount possible to take most withdrawals away like kat said...
    anyways... you should be fine by. The 8th for your other trip...
    but keep in mind if you quit taking subs once your on them you will have withdrawal...

    as suboxone withdrawal ain't no joke either cause its lengthy....jay

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