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Question about Suboxone Treatment. Need Expert Help.
  1. #1
    ndadles is offline New Member
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    Default Question about Suboxone Treatment. Need Expert Help.

    I have been on Suboxone for over a year and a half. I started at 20 MG which I found out was way to much after a year. I dropped down to where I am currently at 8mg and happy. I just started school fulltime and work 52 hours a week. I also attend NA meetings three times a week so I am a busy person. 2 Months ago, I started on a new medication called Doxepin. This is where it starts to get weird.

    I saw my doctor this lats Monday. Before that it was 4 weeks before that, also on a monday. It's always been four weeks. So i've been on Doxepin for 3 months now going on three taking 50MG only at night for sleep. The last 2 times he Drug Tested me for it, (Two Times before this past Monday) he showed me the results, and it shows the drug Pre Metabolized. Not Post Metabolizing. So it only shows the Parent Drug. Now this doesn't look good. The only way this could happen is if I poured it into the cup, says he, which I haven't done. I've been seeing my Doctor for over a year, and if I didn't need the Medication, I wouldn't take it. I have only have 1 relapse in the past year and a half and I was honest when telling him about it.

    This past Monday is when he said something about it, he believes the test. Also, he wanted me to fess up to it, but I was telling the truth. So, he wanted to try to spin up something that could even be plausible which doesn't make sense at all. I didn't break it up and put it into my urine.

    This past Monday, he prescribed me 1 Strip a Day for 2 weeks, when I go back in a little over a week, he will have the results of my 3rd urine and he wants to see what that says, but he already said he has to make the decision of if he will continue to treat me or not. My thing is that I am scared now. I've been slowly working on a taper, and I wouldn't do anything to put that at risk. I don't feel like I can just drop off one strip right now in a week and a half or so.

    I wanted to ask opinon's to wether I should just start cutting down now with what I do have. I only have 13 8mg strips left right now. I am full time school and work and can not take any time off. Even with that, and how long i've been taking it, if he cuts me off because of this BS, I will be pretty bad off. I wanted to ask your guy's opinon's as I have lurked here for years and now finally need your help guys.

    Thanks. Feel free to ask more questions. I do not want to go back, I also am not lying to him, I have been taking all medications as prescribed. I might of missed a day or two on my sleeping med's but not many. Is there any way that the Drug Test would show Pre Metabolized and not Post? I am not dumb enough to think breaking a pill and putting it in my urine would fool a lab test. Also, as I told him it wouldn't benefit me in any way since Doxepin holds no street value and I pay more for it than I could ever make.

    Thanks guys. Sorry for the long post. Just a little worried.
    Last edited by Anonymous; 09-10-2014 at 11:51 AM.

  2. #2
    silverlining1 is offline Senior Member
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    You have definitely found the right place! Many members on this forum are in the midst of tapering, jumped from tapering, or successfully beat the drug and living in freedom.

    All are wonderful to advise and give tips....so, hang in there, help is on its way.

    Read some of the threads about suboxone.....you will be amazed how un-alone you are.

    Harry Smooth has quite a bit of experience, his thread is full of info, etc. He is also a big help, so I'm sure you'll here from him today.

  3. #3
    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    Hi there. Welcome.

    That's just bizarre. All this hoopla over a sleeping med? It's not like your testing negative for Sub, right? If he is heartless enough to discharge you as a patient, ask for an additional refill so you can properly taper off without having to go through WD.

    You said you've been lurking here for a long time. Are you familiar with the taper plan? It calls for a reduction of 25% at each drop, only when stable. I would make the first reduction NOW to 6 mg (25%). Get stable there. Stable means little to no WD symptoms.

    The plan recommends reducing dosage every 4 days by 25%, but people who have been on Sub long term (especially at high doses) generally need to taper slower. I'll post the link to the taper plan when I get home.

    You'll definitely need more Sub to do a proper taper from 8 mg. If that option isn't available, you'll have to taper with what you have. Won't be fun, but it's way better than going cold turkey from 8 mg.

    Be back later.
    Kat
    Last edited by Anonymous; 09-10-2014 at 02:41 PM.

  4. #4
    ndadles is offline New Member
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    Yeah all over a sleeping pill. It's ridiculous. I have seen the taper plan and hopefully he will give me an addition months worth so I can taper. He has never seen heartless till' now.

    What it is, is he thinks I am lying for a bigger reason. He already said that. He knows I'm smart, and in my previous life when I wasn't clean I was extremely manipulative. He knows this, but I'm not trying to manipulate anything. I was on the sleeping medication a year ago for a little as needed, and when I didn't need it anymore I got off, I didn't call him or anything. I was like there is no reason for me to try to add it to my urine, if I didn't need it, I wouldn't pay for it at the pharmacy. It holds no street value so I'm not getting it to resell.

    He tried to come up with some crazy scenario, about how I might not be taking my Suboxone anymore and I'm selling that then using someone else's urine. Right then and there I was like, "If that's the case, I'll take another test to prove it's in my system." I also told him he could search me to make sure I have no urine on me. Also I told him to check the bathroom to see if there was a bag or anything. He refused to search the bathroom, and refused to search me to take another test. He said, he doesn't go into bathrooms with people, and he doesn't search. I can't believe it, like why wouldn't he let me prove it too him. Especially after seeing him from over a year, when he has seen me go from broke, with nothing, to a business owner that is going to back to school at 21 to further himself.

    I just don't get it, but it got me to the point to realize this guy has some issue with control. He likes holding this medication over people's heads as control for some reason. I understand he is the doctor, but after being there for over a year with never lying to him, he just doesn't want to believe me.

    I even said, if the test was the other way what would you say? If the test showed it Metabolized and not Pre Metabolized. He said that would be fine, I was like that isn't fine that means something somewhere got messed up too.

    He said he just wants a Simple Answer to this problem, I said there is no simple answer. He said there is, the simple answer would be I broke the capsule and put it into my urine. That's not the truth so I'm not telling him that to receive further treatment. Treatment involves trust from all parties involved. So even if he wants to continue treatment in two weeks when I go back, I'll be tapering off following this plan immediately, because I can't deal with this stress.

    Sorry, I ranted a little bit. It really has me worked up. I'm not worrying about the Taper. Just worried I won't make it there the right way you know. Over nothing. Literally.

  5. #5
    Randy35 is offline Platinum Member
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    Having the doctor not believe you is not good and I'm sure quite frustrating. I believe you because you sound sincere. I think if it were me I would begin tapering immediately to play it safe. You have plenty of sub left to perform a successful taper. What I would do is reduce my dose to 6mg starting tomorrow, stay there 4-5 days and then reduce by 25% again. Repeat that process until you get to .25mg or so and then either skip days or jump.

    You've been on sub for over a year and a half you say and that's PLENTY long enough. You should ideally get a plan in place once you're off the subs for additional support. A support group like NA, AA, or others is ideal and highly recommended in my opinion.

    I wouldn't take any chances with this doctor. Sounds like he is ready to pull the plug on you so get your dose down now. You should hardly notice the first reduction, and just fight the mental battle that will come as you reduce further. You can do it. Start that dose reduction and get off the subs. You'll be happy you did.

    If this doctor decides to believe you keep taking as much sub as he will prescribe you. Keep it safe and soon you will be able to quit HIM and be on your merry way! Good luck!

  6. #6
    ndadles is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randy35 View Post
    Having the doctor not believe you is not good and I'm sure quite frustrating. I believe you because you sound sincere. I think if it were me I would begin tapering immediately to play it safe. You have plenty of sub left to perform a successful taper. What I would do is reduce my dose to 6mg starting tomorrow, stay there 4-5 days and then reduce by 25% again. Repeat that process until you get to .25mg or so and then either skip days or jump.

    You've been on sub for over a year and a half you say and that's PLENTY long enough. You should ideally get a plan in place once you're off the subs for additional support. A support group like NA, AA, or others is ideal and highly recommended in my opinion.

    I wouldn't take any chances with this doctor. Sounds like he is ready to pull the plug on you so get your dose down now. You should hardly notice the first reduction, and just fight the mental battle that will come as you reduce further. You can do it. Start that dose reduction and get off the subs. You'll be happy you did.

    If this doctor decides to believe you keep taking as much sub as he will prescribe you. Keep it safe and soon you will be able to quit HIM and be on your merry way! Good luck!
    Honestly, I wouldn't be here if I wasn't being honest. It would do me ZERO good to lie here. Same in the Doctor's office too. I don't know what it is honestly, but something doesn't seem right. I think somethings not right with him. I work around Alcohol all day. Not drinking Alcohol but Pure Ethyl for cleaning. I had failed for small amounts of Ethyl before and he has believed me that I haven't drank. If I wanted the Doxepin to show in my system, I wouldn't be stupid enough to break the capsule and put it in the Urinalysis. Every drug test Post Metabolizing. Besides the point, I think if he puts me back on, or wants to continue, I'll be dropping ASAP anyways, because I don't want to be in chains any longer and have to worry every time something like this pops up. Which it never has in the past, but I don't want anything like this to happen again.

    I'll start dropping to six tomorrow. I've been going to 3 NA meeting's a week for a year and a half and have met a ton of good people. Unfortunately a lot of them aren't Sub friendly, so they don't know I'm on Suboxone except my sponsor. I just wanted to get some recommendations from you guys and make sure I'm not thinking crazy for dropping before I go back incase he wants to screw me for whatever reason.

    Thanks for the help Randy!

  7. #7
    ndadles is offline New Member
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    Just wanted to let everyone know, I still haven't heard anything from my Doctor, but I did drop to 6Mg yesterday was the first day, Today being the second. I feel fine so far like I figured I would. Just wanted to say thanks to everybody and let everyone know. A couple more day's then it'll be four.

  8. #8
    iloerose is offline Platinum Member
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    If doxepin has a potential abuse level it is low or non-existent. Who is this guy? Why would he waste money drug testing you for a drug that has so little potential for abuse? It is perhaps the sub interacting with the doxepin. I would follow Randy's suggestion and start your sub taper. You can do this. Make sure you are stable at the 6mg. before you drop again.

    Peace,

    Iloerose

  9. #9
    Kickinit87 is offline Junior Member
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    Thats wierd but possible. Have you been drinking alcohol at all in the days before that drug test? I've heard of stuff like this happening because metabolism not breaking it down, and it could be building up in your system. Which isn't good. I'd ask to get off it and/or switch sleeping med. see what he says.. And Do some research to better understand it and show him. Some docs can be naive to these situations because they do see a lot of crazy stuff like what u describe, but not over a sleeping med. if the argument continues, ask if theres another qualified sub docto he recommends. Be confident. Good luck!

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