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Ready to start hope to finish like Randy35
  1. #1
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    Default Ready to start hope to finish like Randy35

    Hello everyone! This is tough but I’m ready just hope you guys help me like others...

    Not going to write a book about my story and also want to warn upfront my spelling is horrible hope there is an edit option lol... So I have been on prescribed Oxycodome for 7 years now i have tapered down to 60mg from 100mg and I’m done and want my life back! As you all know how painful the constant counting, planning, panicking, just the overall mind ******* the beast brings...

    I do need to mention ironically last year at the same time I made an attempt to quit... It was rough I did a short 5 day sub taper based off Rbt thread and after 7 days I descoverd Kratom.. Wow was my first thought and stayed on that for 5 weeks and quit! Let me be the first to say that was the worst WD ever I’m sure there was some still left over from the oxy but the Kratom was more of a mental pain... it was rough for another 30 days and I taped out and called the doc and got back on my meds... so here we are....

    After reading Roberts taper success with musician and others I figured his taper plan seems the best...
    but was only bummed to find out he was no longer active on the site and I felt like I needed Robert like help from someone or other long term successful members...

    Then I kept reading and reading thread after thread as most of us have and bumped in to Randy35’s thread reading the entire thing and his thread made me want to start the jernoy... I see he is active still as well as many others with him and hope you guys can help me....

    So my plan and the only part that I’m worried about is I have only 14.5 mg of sub to use...I mapped it out and if I start with and hope it’s a stable dose at 1mg I can do the taper in 21 days... the only part that will suck is if I induct and 1mg a day is not enough my taper will be shorter and maybe more painful....

    My plan is to start tomorrow i will take my last dose of oxy here in a few minutes so I think by this time
    Tomorrow I will start the sub....

    I hope you guys are here to help me and I’m excited to start and there is so much more i would like to tell you guys but I’ll start with just this for now! I wish all of you the very best

  2. #2
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    Welcome start-2-finish as you know reading so many awesome threads. Me too Randy was my inspiration and I'm here to tell you I'm days shy of 13 months clean. Excited awesome positive attitude going into this. I'm sure Randy will be around soon to help you with your Journey. We are all here to support you...
    again welcome home...

  3. #3
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    Thanx! Already starting to question this but i left my self with no choice at this point! Time to start! Thanks and congrats on 13 months that’s awesome I can’t wait til I’m posting some time up like that
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  4. #4
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    I actually have 14mg of sub pill form... hoping randy or someone can help me with the break down and best way to make it work...seems like it should be a enough being how powerful it is... thanks ahead of time
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  5. #5
    DravenDomnq is offline Advanced Member
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    Hey Start, welcome to the forums! I have no experience with subs, so don't feel comfortable walking you through Robert's taper plan, but do have a lot of experience jumping off of a pretty hefty dose of oxy. Hopefully Randy or somebody more familiar with subs will be by, but wanted to offer my support as well!

  6. #6
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    Thnx Draven! I’ll need all the support I can get!
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  7. #7
    Beefaroni7272 is offline Advanced Member
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    Hey start-2-finish. Welcome. Glad you found your way back here. As you know this place is amazing. I was addicted to oxy for two years and then subs for 5 after that. Today I am 2.5 months clean and so happy I found this place. I'm not an expert when it comes to short tapers so I will defer to someone else on that feont. Like lvg said I'm sure Randy will be by later to offer you some suggestions and help you on your way. Just wanted to say welcome and congratulations!!

    Keep doing the next right thing!!
    Beef
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  8. #8
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    Thanks beef! I just read through you and dravens threads you guys make me pumped even more!

    Beef I’m at work and didn’t get to finish your whole thread but how are you feeling 2 months out? I made it 60 days off oxy but 30 days off Kratom and I was not doing good I think it was the kratom so I’m hoping this time with out it I’ll be in better shape... That’s my only nagging worry is I keep thinking if I have to go 60 days with no relief I’ll be scared?
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  9. #9
    Beefaroni7272 is offline Advanced Member
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    I was on subs for a long time at a really high dose. When I jumped I did it before I found this place and saw the taper plan. 1 mg is a pretty hefty dose to jump from, but it's doable. But a positive mindset and the motivation and inspiration of all these great people saved me. I thank God for this place every day.

    I'd say I started sloooooowwwwllllyyy turning the corner around 3 weeks. That's the thing with subs, slow progress. Sometimes I felt like I wasn't making any progress at all, and I'd go back and re-read where I was when I got here on day 11. It is the hardest and most rewarding rollercoaster that i have ever been on. So happy to be here and not have the handcuffs on. Can't wait for you to get here!!

    Two months in and I feel better than I have in 10 years. Sure I picked up some bumps and bruises and a few gray hairs, but I have to say I couldn't have asked for more. It's just as good being here as everyone says it is. Sleep still isn't where I would like it to be, but it's not bad either. So I will take it. Been thinking a lot about how I got here over the past 2 weeks and I'm gonna find myself a meeting to go to. I feel like it would be a really good move and I would benefit from it immensely. Anyways, I think I'm starting to ramble. But just know how happy we all are that you made it back.

    Keep doing the next right thing!!!!
    Beef
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  10. #10
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    That’s why I joined after all the years of reading all the threads and seeing how many people have help one another on here it’s definitely been a huge percentage of what’s made me want to take the jump....

    I been catching my self looking at people at work or even in the grocery store and thinking “ wow must be nice to be just standing there noramal not dependent on a drug with a normal life” hahaha well not funny kinda depressing but I’m ready to be that guy now... I’m glad I started my thread first and you guys have started showing support it will make it easy to start tomorrow knowing you guys will be here to catch me...

    I’m already 2nd guessing my self thinking I should take one more good dose of oxy tonight for a last hurra...but I need to get in to WD before I start the sub and I don’t want to start at 10pm tomorrow...

    Thanks for all the support so far
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  11. #11
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    Hey Start-to-finish, jumping in in here I'm not sure if I missed how much and the last time you took the oxys? I know you mentioned reading Roberts subtaper plan but you want to do this once and do it correctly. Have you read the cows sheet? Proud of You for taking this step...
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  12. #12
    Lvg nghtmare is offline Platinum Member
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    originally posted by Randy...

    Using the Cows is the best way to do this. The amount of "time" that passes from your last dose of Oxy until your first dose of Suboxone is unimportant as the time varies between each person using subs. Some people have fast metabolisms while others have slow ones, and others fall in the middle somewhere. With the Cows it takes all the guessing out of it. So I would allow as much time as you possibly can.

    The clinic suggest you wait only 12 hours and that would scare me to death. I would go MUCH longer than that. The risk of precipitated withdrawals is very real and I guarantee you will want to do everything possible to deter them from happening. You believe that 36 hours will be enough and it very well could be? What I would do if it were me is stop the Oxy completely AT LEAST 72 hours prior to your planned induction. That way you take no chances on PWD's jumping in your face. I've been through them twice and they are no joke I assure you. You should be able to make it 3 days without the Oxy if you remain positive and use every ounce of determination you have.

    The longer you wait the better it will be. The sicker you get in wd's the lower the amount of Suboxone you'll need in most every case. You only have to do this once if you do it right.

    What should you expect from the subs? And how will they make you feel? Well if you do this correctly you'll go from being very sick in wd's from the Oxy to feeling quite well after the first and second dose of Suboxone. The wd's will practically disappear after a hour or so on the subs. They will make you feel as normal as possible. You'll be able to do anything you want to do without worrying about chasing pills and gobbling them down. Active addictive goes bye bye.

    It's possible you could feel a few symptoms the first day, but that happens to most who don't follow the plan I mentioned. Taking too much sub for example can make you feel bad as it's terribly strong.

    The clinic will most likely place you on 8-16mgs of sub per day. That's ridiculous, but that's what most do. Just take what they have you take and hopefully they'll give you a script and send you on your way. Come right back here after your appointment on 11/27 and we can get you on the right track I promise.

    Yes, I would begin to taper the Oxy today. Who knows, you might get down to a crumb well before your induction date and be able to avoid the subs altogether? Wouldn't that be Awesome? No one says you HAVE to take the subs if you can do this by tapering the Oxy or even CT it.

  13. #13
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    Yea I’m aware of the cows and scared to death of PW so I plan to make sure I’m ready.... I took 15mg couple hours ago.... so I’m sure I’ll be ready by 5:00pm tomorrow which is my plan... I have a busy day of work tomorrow so if I cave I’m for sure going to start Sunday... I know it already sounds like I’m coming up with excuses but I should really start on a day I’m not working but I want to get the show on the road so I’m going to stick to the plan...not sure why i decided to do this again over the holidays and trust me was not on purpose and it was super tough to do this during the Holliday’s ..

    Anyway I want to be doing better by Christmas or at least in better spirits... I would wait til after the new year but I have no choice have one on the way and I want to be done before the baby gets here!

  14. #14
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    Sorry that last reply was before you sent the Randy message ... thanks that’s good Info I didn’t think about the longer you wait the less sub you will need at induction that sounds good to me since I’m limited on what i have.... thanks a million
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  15. #15
    Forceout is offline Member
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    Default Hello Start and Welcome Back!!!

    Hello Start!!!

    Welcome to the forum.

    Congrats on your decision to have the life you deserve. I am truly excited for you!!! Every time someone new comes in here ready to do this.....man, I get so excited and pump up, I can't even tell you.

    I'm glad you are here.

    I stumbled in here in the middle of a hydro taper about a month ago and now I'm on day 21 clean.

    The taper and jump was tough but I listened to these people and did everything they suggested. I wanted CoNTrOL of my life back very badly and let me tell you my friend, that is exactly what is happening!!! I am so happy I stuck it out... omg.

    I'm not where I want to be yet but I am definitely well on my way there!

    I am a new person after five long years of every single day hydrocodone use. Pain management following multiple surgeries. Sadly, it's a common story these days. The important thing, however, is here we are facing the monster down!!!!

    I really doubt I would have made it to where I am without the caring people that pulled me up when I reached out for help in here. You have come to the right place and I think you already feel it!!

    i don't have experience with subs but I'm here to encourage and listen. Post as much as you need.

    Forceout
    Last edited by Anonymous; 12-01-2017 at 10:56 PM. Reason: Welcome Back

  16. #16
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    Forceout thanks bro your the man!! I will do by best to pay my gratitude back to this place when I’m in the position to help, motivate, support and pump up new members... I have read a million and one threads and I have seen people slip up and have seen them not slip and stay strong and in every case someone on here was right there to help them through every step to the point there many days clean!!

    So is randy like the new Robert? I was so bummed when I found out he was out the game that dude was here for so many people and is like a king on here... I was hoping someone took his spot and seem like randy is filling his shoes...

    Congrats on 21 days dude! Can’t wait til I’m there! when we get to over a years clean 21 days apart is nothing but 21 days now and in the begging I’m super far away lol...

    I keep having all the floods of flash backs of last year and how bad it was and just keep 2nd guesssing my self and asking if I’m truly ready for this... I have got rid of all my pills so I can’t change my mind!!! That was tough but for some reason this time I also feel less scared and more excited like I got this lol.... Then again also think It’s all good until the WD kicks in then I’ll think What did i just do to my self hahah...

    Thanks again bro I hope you and the others or at least one of you guys are here when the **** hits the fan... It hasn’t started yet and I’m already stalking my thread for reply’s that’s what sucks if I go days at a time with no one on here replying but I have to jus push on through... I know everyone has a life and there own stuff going on and can’t baby sit me through this... lol

    I definitely get more excited reading post like yours and how your pumped for me... makes it feel like I don’t want to let any of you guys down and will help me not jump back on...

  17. #17
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    I’m starting to panic a little bit!I just went back Read over Roberts old threads that made me decide to do a longer taper then 5-7 days I tried last time and i over looked a huge step that I can’t beilive I missed...

    I got so hung up on how to taper down and it being about 3 weeks and this is what I set my mind and prepared for... well I missed the part that sounds the most important that I need to take subs at optimal dose for at least 2-3 weeks to get through the detox before starting the taper

    This is terrible news for me I only have the 14mg I guess if I stretch it out over 21 days instead of 5 like last time it has to be a little better... any way it’s to late now I have committed and flushed my prescription

    Please someone tell me if I’m
    Screwed ?
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  18. #18
    Randy35 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Start-2-Finish View Post
    I’m starting to panic a little bit!I just went back Read over Roberts old threads that made me decide to do a longer taper then 5-7 days I tried last time and i over looked a huge step that I can’t beilive I missed...

    I got so hung up on how to taper down and it being about 3 weeks and this is what I set my mind and prepared for... well I missed the part that sounds the most important that I need to take subs at optimal dose for at least 2-3 weeks to get through the detox before starting the taper

    This is terrible news for me I only have the 14mg I guess if I stretch it out over 21 days instead of 5 like last time it has to be a little better... any way it’s to late now I have committed and flushed my prescription

    Please someone tell me if I’m
    Screwed ?


    Welcome to you! Just woke up and decided to check the forum. Your thread was the first one I read. Glad you joined and as you already have seen, this is an amazing place for hep and support. Please stick with this thread and don't post on the others and they will disappear into the archives.

    Ok, I'll tell you that short tapers rarely work. The relapse rate is very high, A person should remain on Suboxone until they have gotten past their addictive thoughts and behaviors. By the time you have tapered off the subs you should be hating drugs and never want to abuse them again. Robert's plan takes about 6-8 weeks and that's usually the right amount of time. As you know reading my thread (and thank you for doing that) I remained on the Suboxone for about 9 months, by choice. If I would have gotten off after a couple months I knew that I would have positively relapsed. I wasn't ready to get off. That's just me. You have to form your own plan with the subs and know when you're ready to get off.

    Now I HIGHLY recommend you use the Cows to induct. Getting to that score of 26 lets you know it's safe to take the subs. I went into precipitated wd's twice because I got in a big hurry to induct. And let me tell you right now that PW's are no joke. You'll think you're dying. I went to the ER and there is NOTHING they can do, just have to let them pass. So use that Cows, and score yourself honestly and accurately. You may be able to start on Sunday as you plan, but you may not be ready? The Cows will let you know when you're ready.

    You said you only have a limited amount of Suboxone. Any chance you can get more to do the taper the right way? If not we'll have to form a plan based on the amount you have. The 14mg you have is quite a lot of sub if they are the 8mg ones? We can certainly get going with that amount, but you may need a few more to do this right. So think about that and we'll deal with that after.

    Once you're ready to begin I would stat your induction with a .5mg (1/2 of 1mg) dose. Wait one full hour to give it plaenty of time to work. After that take only .25mg (1/4 of 1mg) doses every HOUR until you're stable.

    It's late and I'm tired. I'll get back to you later. Thank you for seeking me out. I'm honored to help you. Rest assured there are others here with the knowledge and experience to help you too. This place saved my life along with the Suboxone. I have to pay back what was freely given to me. I urge you to consider going to some face to face meetings of NA or AA. Getting clean is only half the battle. Remaining clean takes the real work. Those meetings will help do that for you. I hope you'll consider going.

    Talk to you later,
    Randy
    Last edited by Anonymous; 12-02-2017 at 03:29 AM.

  19. #19
    Randy35 is offline Platinum Member
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    Before I go back to dreamland I wanted to say a few other things. I want to let you know that if you do this the right way, and if you do it the right way you'll only have to do it once.

    All the horror stories you read about subs and how terrible they are, are always for the same reasons. If someone follows Robert's plan from start to ficish they will be a success and not a horry story.

    The reasons the horror stories appear is always because a person.....

    1. Have a Suboxone doctor that knows nothing about Suboxone.
    2. That doctor places patients on doses of 8mg to 24mg as their daily dose at the induction.
    3. A person remains on Suboxone way too long (years).
    4. You take Suboxone on an "as needed" basis.
    5. Tapering way too fast.
    6. Tapering by too many mgs.
    7. Jumping for too high of a dose.

    There are a couple other reasons, but those are the most common ones. If you are reading someone's thread and they are saying Suboxone failed them, or they would never use subs again, and they have problems with theor sub therapy, it's always because of one of those reasons above.

    If you stick very close to Robert's plan (and it can be tweaked as it's not written in stone) yopu'll be another success story!

    Randy

  20. #20
    Anonymous Guest

    Default Randy

    Randy - I notice you are around so much more lately. Thank goodness. You are needed on here with your knowledge, opinions, and fun loving ways. Life gets busy, people come and go, but when one comes back, such as yourself, it's a treat for so many. You are up mighty late, or your time line is behind the great Midwest. It looks like you're going to bed while I am getting up! LOL Keep on spreading the love, because that's what it is, love.

    Hope.
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  21. #21
    Randy35 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by hopes1211 View Post
    Randy - I notice you are around so much more lately. Thank goodness. You are needed on here with your knowledge, opinions, and fun loving ways. Life gets busy, people come and go, but when one comes back, such as yourself, it's a treat for so many. You are up mighty late, or your time line is behind the great Midwest. It looks like you're going to bed while I am getting up! LOL Keep on spreading the love, because that's what it is, love.

    Hope.


    Thank you, Hope, you're so sweet. I do find myself around here more lately. I'm so busy with life in general, work, play, and planning a wedding. When I do get a free minute or hour, I usually come here. It seems more and more members are joining and looking for answers. It really helps me to post. Have to pay back was was freely given to me right. Yes, I was up VERY late for me. Woke up because I was tossing and turning for some reason. So having trouble sleeping even though I have over 3 years clean. So it's not always the drugs.

    I hope you're doing well. I know you've struggled for a lomg time, but I also know you're doing well these days. Keep up the good work. I'm very proud of you and I thank you again for the kind words. Take care.

    Randy
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  22. #22
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    Randy thank for stopping by!!! I’m
    Excited you showed up but bummed I only have 14mg of sub so just to be clear it’s one 8mg pill a half of 4mg and a 2mg peace... So it maybe tough to get eonough or impossible 6-8 weeks worth... so I guess for now I’ll use what I have....

    Woke up this morning slept fine and actually feel ok not taking my oxy dose...I know that will change but for now I’m ready to do this... Im going to try and keep the thoughts out that I don’t have enough sub to do this because that by it self may make me say screw it hahaha...

    That sucks you got no sleep or spotty last night! I had good sleep and soon will forget what that feels like lol...

    Thanks and ready for war!

  23. #23
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    Also Randy I forgot to mention I read the sticky that Robert made to do the short term taper and I swear I read that you wait for 26 on COWS then induct stay on the stable dose for 4 days and then start tapering 25% every 4 days... And this is why I was under the impression I could do this in 3 weeks... I didn’t see were Robert said to remain on the subs for 3weeks then taper like he did in MusicaMan thread ....

    UnlessI missed it again??? I hope I can do this in 21 days of small starting stabledose then taper

    Thanks hope everyone is doing great this Saturday morning

  24. #24
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    Sorry I have another question...when it comes to making super small doses is it better to weigh them on a scale and devide evenly to be exact or just make small even piles?

    So far so good waiting for the freight Train to come!

  25. #25
    Brotop is offline Member
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    Hey start (soon to be finished)
    A little over a month ago I was using mostly oxy and some vic at the same time. I would say 60mg of oxy and 40mg of Vic. I started decreasing with the oxy and kept the same vic. I completely stopped the oxy and increased the vic thinking I could taper better on the Vic. I finally got down to 5mg every 4 hours. I however was still withdrawing even at that dosing. I just couldn't go anymore and feeling completely defeated in myself I went to a recovery center this Tuesday for help. The last vic I took was at 7am on Tuesday morning before my appointment. She gave me suboxone to start taking. I started the subs on Tuesday night at 8pm.

  26. #26
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    Thanks for the post Brotop! Cool so we are kinda in the same boat as far as opioit amounts before subs... what dose did you end up stabling out on? I’m hoping 1mg will do it for me .5 to start and another .5 if need be... I’ll hope for the best

  27. #27
    Randy35 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Start-2-Finish View Post
    Also Randy I forgot to mention I read the sticky that Robert made to do the short term taper and I swear I read that you wait for 26 on COWS then induct stay on the stable dose for 4 days and then start tapering 25% every 4 days... And this is why I was under the impression I could do this in 3 weeks... I didn’t see were Robert said to remain on the subs for 3weeks then taper like he did in MusicaMan thread ....

    UnlessI missed it again??? I hope I can do this in 21 days of small starting stabledose then taper

    Thanks hope everyone is doing great this Saturday morning


    When Robert325 wrote the Suboxone Therapy Plan he had no one to guide him, and no previous experiences of anyone to go by. He wrote the plan based on what HE thought was best. He used only himself to guide him. And make no mistake, it's a plan that has produced Thousands of success stories, and I am one of them. But since Robert wrote the plan we have discovered the plan can be "tweaked" a bit. An example is Robert reduced down to .5mg then jumped. We've found that going lower in dose, to at least .25mg, is far better, and produces less wd symptoms when done with the subs. We've also discovered through experience that going lower than .25mg is even better. I reduced to .125mg before jumping for example. Man ygo down to .18mg, then to .12mg before jumping or usinfg the day skipping process.

    Yes, you're right, Robert suggests once the induction is successful, you spend about 4 days then start the taper process. Many do that and are are fine with it. We have found that may not be enough time on the Suboxone for some people. It certainly wasn't for me, I needed nearly 9 months on the sub. That's why the short tapers rarely produce success. Not enough time on the subs to get our heads away from our addictive thoughts, actions, and cravings. I'm NOT saying you need to be on the sub for months and months, or years, I'm saying 4 days on the sub may not be enough time for everyone. It usually isn't to be honest, and I work with a LOT of Suboxone patients through NA and AA. I know what works and what doesn't.

    If 12mg -14mg is all you have, and all you can get you have no choice but to do a short taper. That has to be your call. But if you can get to a Suboxone doctor and get more subs that would certainly be the ideal situation, and highly recommended.

    Just crush the pills you have with the back of a spoon or pill crusher available at most pharmacies and crush the pill into a fine powder. Separate the powder into equal piles. Label what you have because it's very easy to forget later.

    I can formulate a taper plan for you based on the subs you have. But first let me know if going to a Suboxone doctor is possible?

    Randy
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  28. #28
    Randy35 is offline Platinum Member
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    Another thought comes to mind and I hope you'll consider it. Maybe you can do this without using the Suboxone? Stop the Oxy and you'll have about a weeks worth of symptoms. The 2nd through the 4th days are usually the worst of it. Get through those days and you'll begin feeling much better.

    You can treat your symptoms with the Thomas Recipe and a host of other vitamins and supplements. Exercise will also help you get through the detox. Lots of protein will provide energy.

    Something to think about. Subs are powerful opiates. If you can do this without the subs I think that's a far better approach. My opinion only,

    Randy
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  29. #29
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    Randy thank you for helping me through this!

    I do not have a way to see a sub doc unfortunately and I’m scared to get stuck on the subs... I’m hoping I can do this with what I have I may see if there is anyway to get a couple more if possible but for now I think I’m stuck with what i have.

    I’m starting to feel >>>>>> but holding up. Not fun to do this at work lol

  30. #30
    Start-2-Finish is offline Junior Member
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    Dec 2017
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    Sorry posted my before seeing your last post Randy.., I was thinking of maybe doing that do you think a little peace of sub here and there when things get super bad would be a bad idea? I maybe able to skip days and just get some mild relief in between days

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