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Starting Suboxone
  1. #61
    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisgt46 View Post
    Thanks for the advice Kat! I have a couple of questions. I'm feeling like I probably won't sleep much tonight, I have a bunch of Librium, can I take some? Next, I cut an 8mg strip into 1mg pieces, , should I treat tomorrow's dose as an induction, by taking 1mg, or even half at a time?
    No, don't treat tomorrow as an induction unless you're willing to stop taking Sub, go into WD and then start from the beginning. I think the best thing to do from this point on is just stick with the 4mg split every day, same times. Give your body a chance to adjust. That's most important right now.

    I don't know anything about Librium. Is it an addictive med? If so, best to stay away. If you must use it, be careful with it. Melatonin works wonders for me - 5mg 30 min before bed and before a hot bath.

    Kat

  2. #62
    chrisgt46 is offline Member
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    Okay then, thanks!

  3. #63
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    I gave some thought to going to an AA meeting tonight, but it occurred to me that someone might ask me how long I've been sober, to which I would have to respond with either, I'm not quite sober yet, I'm on Suboxone, which would probably end the conversation horribly, or lie and give the day I quit oxy. Through the fellowship I put together 5 years back awhile ago, and I miss it.

  4. #64
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    The realization has hit that this might get rough, and not far away is the Suboxone, which would end the suffering, I'm going to have to develop a spine here to keep from dosing.

  5. #65
    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisgt46 View Post
    I gave some thought to going to an AA meeting tonight, but it occurred to me that someone might ask me how long I've been sober, to which I would have to respond with either, I'm not quite sober yet, I'm on Suboxone, which would probably end the conversation horribly, or lie and give the day I quit oxy. Through the fellowship I put together 5 years back awhile ago, and I miss it.
    You should go to the meeting! I had the same fear about saying I was on Sub because it seemed some people had an issue with it. As far as I'm concerned, that's ridiculous. Nobody at an AA or NA meeting has the right to judge anyone else, period. These people who think they're somehow "above" the whole sub thing really get on my last nerve. Eventually I said to hell with what anyone thinks, and I started going. I told them I was tapering off Sub. I had so much support. There was this one old timer who made a face when I mentioned Sub, but I didn't give two damns what he thought, lol.

    Please give yourself a couple days at least. When we first start Sub, we expect to feel perfect. That's not how it works. If we need to up your dose a little, that's ok. Just stay put for now unless the symptoms become really uncomfortable.

    Kat
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  6. #66
    alexnt is offline Platinum Member
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    Chris I just signed in now and I see you ended up taking 4 mg today. I am a little surprised you needed to take anything today after taking 16 mg yesterday and it may have been more mentally then physically but that is just a guess on my part and I am in no way criticizing you for taking the 4 mg today. Since you took 4 mg today I would just go ahead and take 4 mg tomorrow and lets see if you can get stable at 4 mg daily. I only dosed once a day right around noon my entire taper but plenty of people divide there daily dose into 2 doses a day. You do not need to dose 12 hours apart as I know a lot of people take a morning dose and then take there second dose 8 to 10 hours later. I am not trying to scare you by mentioning this but my first 5 or 6 days on subs were a little rough. I think part of it was because I was on to high of a dose of subs. It took my body about 5 days to adjust to being on subs after years of fent and oxi. I had lack of appetite some insomnia and anxiety and was constipated at first. I started subs on a Monday and it took until Friday or Saturday before I felt back to normal. The good thing though is I was not dopesick at all those days. I am glad to see you have some experience with a 12 step program like AA in your past and have used it in the past and have seen how it helps. I hope that the 4 mg you took today holds you and that it will do the trick tomorrow and that you can stabilize at 4 mg. If not you can always adjust and add more. The most important thing is to find the dose where you are comfortable and get stable there before starting the taper plan. The good thing about subs at least for me was that I never felt any kind of high from it and never once felt an urge to take more then my daily dose during my entire taper. Keep posting Chris as much as you need to and I will talk to you later.

    Alex

  7. #67
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    Chris I meant to mention this to you before but forgot to. There is a thread here in the sub forums that I bumped up last night so that its near the top of the page that you may want to browse over. Its called my plan to kick vicodin habit with suboxone by a member Lincolnecho. His situation was a bit different then yours in that his habit was much smaller then yours and he was able to induct at only 2 mg a day which is lower then you but it shows a successful sub taper from beginning to end. With skip days and going down to a last dose of .187 he spent a total of 50 days on suboxone. The point of it is its a good thread to read for someone who is just starting out on subs even if it is more then 2 mg a day. It shows that once one gets stable at a starting dose that the taper plan that Robert 325 came up with and that thousands have used by now works and that it is very doable and that one can jump off without much trouble. You might want to check it out as I believe its a good thread to read to help someone new to subs see a positive thread.

    Alex
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  8. #68
    chrisgt46 is offline Member
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    Hi and thanks, I slept okay last night, it's nice to read a thread that shows someone was successful with the taper. Thanks for that Alex. I'm ready for the day!

  9. #69
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    Thanks Kat, honestly I did expect to feel perfect. Now I know different.

  10. #70
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    If I understand the half life of this stuff correctly then I should have about 8mg's coursing through my veins. That includes this morning'so 2mg's dose. If today I start to experience withdrawal symptoms I will have to endure it. I need to get to 4mg's, then 3mg's within 3 more days I think. I'm so grateful for the people who have been commenting on my thread, you people are angels! Thank you so much!

  11. #71
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    I'm super emotional today, threw on Third Eye Blind's "Slow Motion", and "God of Wine", and cried like a 12 year old girl.....

  12. #72
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    I'm finding that when I eat something, I feel better. It's temporary, but at least it's something.

  13. #73
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    It's been nearly 5 hours since my morning 2mg dose. I'm feeling okay. I'm wondering if I will need the entire 2mg afternoon dose. I'm unemployed right now , which is both a blessing and a curse. A blessing becuase I don't have to struggle through a days work, a curse because I have entirely too much time on my hands. I'm going to dig out my big booK this afternoon, and use it to try and learn what I so obviously missed the last time I read through it For the first time in 3 years, I feel alive. I have genuine feeling, both of emotion and physical reality. I hope I'm ready for the challenges I know are ahead, and pray that God carries me through it. I posted on another message board where no one seemed to be aware of the Robert plan. My hope is that someone who is researching Suboxone will find these stories, and possibly spare themselves from Suboxone addiction. Suboxone seems to be a mirmiracle drug, but so did oxy, and had I walked away, when the real pain ended, things might have been very different. I'm going to get on the treadmill today. Our brains' are bilateral, that is the act of shifting your weight, from side to side, activates your brains' ability to heal both physical, and emotional injury. Hypnosis is based on that theory, and they have been having success treating PTSD with it. That's it for now. Peace!

  14. #74
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    I was only able to walk for 5 minutes, but there was a marked improvement in my condition because of it. Part of me is anxious to get to an AA meeting, but I'm going to wait for a couple of days before I do that.

  15. #75
    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    Hey Chris,

    As long as you go 4 full days of being stable (little to no WD symtoms), them it's ok to make your first 25% reduction to 3mg. Being stable before a drop is the most crucial part of a taper.

    I'm glad you brought up exercise. It will help you tremendously during your taper and after you jump. Everyone who exercises regularly during a taper seems to have an easier time than those who don't.

    Jesus, I can't believe you were shot. If you don't mind me asking, how did that happen??

    Kat

  16. #76
    chrisgt46 is offline Member
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    I've now taken the 2nd dose of medicine for the day. I'm symptom free to this point. The weather is beautiful so I think that I might go for a short walk later.

  17. #77
    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisgt46 View Post
    I've now taken the 2nd dose of medicine for the day. I'm symptom free to this point. The weather is beautiful so I think that I might go for a short walk later.
    Chris,

    Please remember: it's VERY important to take your doses at the same time every day. This helps to get stable. Take your doses at least 8-10 hours apart.

    Kat

  18. #78
    chrisgt46 is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iwantoff2013 View Post
    Chris,

    Please remember: it's VERY important to take your doses at the same time every day. This helps to get stable. Take your doses at least 8-10 hours apart.

    Kat
    Thanks Kat, I took them approximately 9 hours apart, but about 2 hours later than yesterday this afternoon, I'll remember to take them at the same time tomorrow. I wound up getting about a half hour of walking in today, and a side from some anxiety, I feel good.

  19. #79
    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisgt46 View Post
    Thanks Kat, I took them approximately 9 hours apart, but about 2 hours later than yesterday this afternoon, I'll remember to take them at the same time tomorrow. I wound up getting about a half hour of walking in today, and a side from some anxiety, I feel good.
    Lol...I'm such a dork. For some reason I thought you took both doses this morning. My bad.

    Kat

  20. #80
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    LOL, glad you're helping. Thank you
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  21. #81
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    For the last hour or so, I've had the sweats. They come and go. I guess the induction dose is wearing off now. Feels like it's going to be a rough night.

  22. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisgt46 View Post
    For the last hour or so, I've had the sweats. They come and go. I guess the induction dose is wearing off now. Feels like it's going to be a rough night.
    Chris your body is still adjusting to suboxone so that could explain the sweats. I see where you got a half an hour of walking in today and that is good. I do not know if you are taking any supplements yet but there are a few things that you might want to take while you are tapering. A complete multivitamin/multimineral supplement daily. Also a vitamin b complex and extra potassium also. If you find that your energy level becomes low then a lot of people take L-Tyrosine 500 pills while tapering. For it to work it needs to have vitamin b6 in it. It makes some people a little jittery so you would have to see how it works for you. I took 1 or 2 of those in the morning on an empty stomach while I tapered. Also stay well hydrated while your tapering. You mentioned getting to 3 mg within 3 days but you are still in the induction stage right now so before you do drop to 3 mg make sure you are completely stable at 4 mg before you do drop to 3 mg. If you feel ok at 4 mg after 3 more days then drop but if you would need more time then it would be fine. Being stable before your first drop is probably the most important thing about the taper plan. Hope that rest of your night is ok and I will talk to you later.

    Alex

  23. #83
    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisgt46 View Post
    I'm super emotional today, threw on Third Eye Blind's "Slow Motion", and "God of Wine", and cried like a 12 year old girl.....
    Awww. Yeah, that's pretty normal, especially once we've made the decision to start our recovery and are no longer abusing pills. Not being high all the time brings out a lot of emotions that were numb for so long. Go with it. It's all part of the process

    Sleep well, friend...
    Kat

  24. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by alexnt View Post
    Chris your body is still adjusting to suboxone so that could explain the sweats. I see where you got a half an hour of walking in today and that is good. I do not know if you are taking any supplements yet but there are a few things that you might want to take while you are tapering. A complete multivitamin/multimineral supplement daily. Also a vitamin b complex and extra potassium also. If you find that your energy level becomes low then a lot of people take L-Tyrosine 500 pills while tapering. For it to work it needs to have vitamin b6 in it. It makes some people a little jittery so you would have to see how it works for you. I took 1 or 2 of those in the morning on an empty stomach while I tapered. Also stay well hydrated while your tapering. You mentioned getting to 3 mg within 3 days but you are still in the induction stage right now so before you do drop to 3 mg make sure you are completely stable at 4 mg before you do drop to 3 mg. If you feel ok at 4 mg after 3 more days then drop but if you would need more time then it would be fine. Being stable before your first drop is probably the most important thing about the taper plan. Hope that rest of your night is ok and I will talk to you later.

    Alex
    Thanks Alex, I have the supplements, I'll make sure to be stable for four complete days. Last night was rough. So I can't count that as one.

  25. #85
    chrisgt46 is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iwantoff2013 View Post
    Awww. Yeah, that's pretty normal, especially once we've made the decision to start our recovery and are no longer abusing pills. Not being high all the time brings out a lot of emotions that were numb for so long. Go with it. It's all part of the process

    Sleep well, friend...
    Kat
    Thanks Kat, I find myself getting choked up quite easily. Good to know I'm not alone. Hope you had a great night.

  26. #86
    chrisgt46 is offline Member
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    I'm wondering if I can take. 25 or. 5 mg if tonight turns into what last night did? Maybe I need a little higher dose? Or should I just wait to stabilize on the 4mg's? I think I know what the answer will be. .....

  27. #87
    Iwantoff2013 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisgt46 View Post
    I'm wondering if I can take. 25 or. 5 mg if tonight turns into what last night did? Maybe I need a little higher dose? Or should I just wait to stabilize on the 4mg's? I think I know what the answer will be. .....
    Sorry I didn't reply sooner. I'm on So Cal time so it's only 8:30 am here...

    What happened last night?? Are you having symptoms right now?

    It's been 3 days since you inducted. If you're uncomfortable, then I think it's time to increase a little. Try a .5mg or 1mg and see if that helps. It should!

    I'll check back soon.
    Kat

  28. #88
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    I'm sweating profusely and having stomach issues. It starts happening about 7 hours out from my last dose for my next dose I'm going to try a little more, thanks so much for responding!

  29. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by chrisgt46 View Post
    I'm sweating profusely and having stomach issues. It starts happening about 7 hours out from my last dose for my next dose I'm going to try a little more, thanks so much for responding!
    That sucks. Ok, add 1mg...

    Kat

  30. #90
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    After I left Chicago, I moved to California. Lived in Santa Clara, San Jose, and Campbell. That's where I developed the meth problem. I was there from 89-99. Crazy stuff happening nightly there. I never got used to the nightly helicopter chases, lol. I'd be tweaking with the lights out, peeking out of my blinds thinking they were coming for me.

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