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Tapered to 4mg now I'm out. What have I done?
  1. #1
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    Default Tapered to 4mg now I'm out. What have I done?

    I've been on subs for 3 1/2 years. I started tapering but started too late. I dropped 25% every 4-5 days. Turns out I needed to go much slower. Took forever to stabilize at 4mg. And I'm not really great there. Now I'm out. I'm mentally prepared for life to suck Sunday through whenever. Still have to care for kids and work.
    So I plan to document my journey here. Any support is appreciated.

  2. #2
    Randy35 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightingaler View Post
    I've been on subs for 3 1/2 years. I started tapering but started too late. I dropped 25% every 4-5 days. Turns out I needed to go much slower. Took forever to stabilize at 4mg. And I'm not really great there. Now I'm out. I'm mentally prepared for life to suck Sunday through whenever. Still have to care for kids and work.
    So I plan to document my journey here. Any support is appreciated.

    Welcome! Glad you're here!

    Jumping or stopping at 4mg of sub is something that's NEVER recommended doing. Maybe you can't get more or perhaps you don't want to? If a person wants off it's their right to do so. I have to be honest as tell you that I expect you to be in a world of hurt. At least for w while. Sub is so strong, with a very long half life. The amount you've been taking will remain in your system for quite some time. Hard to establish just how long.

    Withdrawals don't usually beign until the 3rd or 4th day due to the half life keeping you fairly stable. Once they begin to get rough it will probably last a week or longer. And because you've been taking the sub for 3 1/2 years, and your previous dose was over 4mg, and now you're quitting at a 4mg daily dose, you actually jumped or stopped from a much higher amount than you think. You aren't actually stoppping at 4mg, theres a much higher amount left in your system that will need to dissipate.

    You have 2 choices - keep plugging along and treat the symptoms as best you can. Theres tons of vitamins and supplements that will help to a certain degree. Maybe try the Thomas Recipe. Drink lots and lots of fluids. Get some exercise too. Sitting around and watching the clock will be your worse enemy.

    If you find after a few days you just can't handle the symptoms you can always get back on a stable dose and taper down slow and steady while getting to as low a dose as possible. We always suggest the 25% dose reductions every 4 or so days that you were doing previously. If you can get the dosw down to at least .25mg before jumping or skipping days it will limit the severity of wd symptoms or eliminate them altogether. Make a decision and stick with it.

    Just to be clear I hope you can continue and make it. You have my full support no matter what you decide to do. Has it been done before, yes it has, but not than many times I'm afraid to say. Keep journaling as you plan to do. Plenty pf help and support here that's for sure.

    All the best to you. I'm here if you need me.

    Randy
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  3. #3
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    I have been on 4 mg for a week. And I did not mean to do this to myself. I ran out and now I'm stuck with it. I thought I had enough to taper but I was wrong. I have no hope of getting anymore.

  4. #4
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    Sorry I hit reply too quick. I am scared but I see no way out. It won't kill me. I may wish that it does. Thank you for your support

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    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    At work. Starting to feel the chest squeezing a bit. It's definitely worse when I'm sitting at home. At least at work, I'm occupied. I have to work again Sunday night and then I'm home until Saturday night. I'm thinking I will still be hurting pretty bad next weekend since I'm just starting to feel some of it now.
    I just keep telling myself, hey I've taken to last sub of my life. The last one dammitt!!!

  6. #6
    lifeismello is offline New Member
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    Hey Nightingaler, how goes it so far? Any updates on how you're doing?

  7. #7
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    Finally through my weekend of work. Was dragging last night but nothing crazy. I can feel that squeeze in my chest rising a bit. But I'm trying to tell myself, for every withdrawal symptom, there's a negative effect on my body that's getting better. I was having swelling in my legs, which has improved. I don't feel so dried out anymore. I know I haven't hit the worst yet. That should happen soon. Bring it on!
    I used to be so afraid of this. I may be singing a different tune by Wednesday hahaha. Thanks for your support.
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  8. #8
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    Just waking up on day 4 off subs. Took a gabapentin and some kava last night. Slept well. Gotta get my kid off to school and drag my sorry tail to the poll. Can you believe Election Day is finally here?! God help us.

  9. #9
    Randy35 is offline Platinum Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightingaler View Post
    Just waking up on day 4 off subs. Took a gabapentin and some kava last night. Slept well. Gotta get my kid off to school and drag my sorry tail to the poll. Can you believe Election Day is finally here?! God help us.

    Wooo Hooo, day 4 and you've made it! Good for you! I would expect this to be the day any wd's would hit the hardest, IF they get bad at all. Just go about your day and stay as busy as possible. If it happens it happens. Theres no rule saying things WILL get worse, just the probability they will based on evidence.

    Voting should take your mind off things for a while today!

    All the Best to you!

    Randy
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  10. #10
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    Thanks randy.
    I think I'm a slow metabolized. So your right. Today or maybe even tomorrow should begin the suck fest. I had an opportunity to get some more over the weekend but I said no. I just can't put that stuff in my body again.
    On with democracy!! Have a great day!
    Last edited by Anonymous; 11-08-2016 at 01:19 PM.
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  11. #11
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    Hello chest pain. Woke me bout an hour ago. I had only been asleep a couple hours. Let the suckfest begin.
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  12. #12
    thed is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightingaler View Post
    Hello chest pain. Woke me bout an hour ago. I had only been asleep a couple hours. Let the suckfest begin.
    How ya doing? Sounds like you're handling it alright? ...inspiration for those of us scared to hop off a much lower dose!

  13. #13
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    If I didn't have clonidine I would be on the street looking. I only have a few of them. So I will see how this goes. The fatigue is impressive but nothing is worse than the burning crushing pain in my chest. Clonidine takes it away. I know what it is. It's adrenaline. It's like being in a fight or flight mode constantly.
    Mentally, I am OK. And start taking Prozac Sunday I think. So maybe that's helpful. I took kava for a couple of days until I found out I was not supposed to take that with Prozac. Oops. The worst thing is I'm a single-parent with a small child. I could not even get up to take her to preschool today.
    Enough of my whining. This is just something I have to go through and it sucks balls. But my body will be better for it. Suboxone has ruined my vision. I'm hoping that that will stop. The swelling in my legs has stopped.
    I actually called the outpatient treatment facility where I was getting subs. When they cut me off and the doctor left town, they said if you have problems call us. So I've called. I left a message telling them my situation and that I only wanted a script for clonidine. They won't even return my call. Excellent patient care huh?
    Last edited by Anonymous; 11-10-2016 at 03:33 PM. Reason: Misspelling
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  14. #14
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    RLS!! all over my body. I took clonidine, flexeril. Didn't touch it. It kept getting worse. I had only 2 Requip. So I tried one. No change. I checked my vitals again to make sure I wasn't dropping my BP. Took a Xanax 0.25 and another clonidine. Finally got it under control. And was day 2 of withdrawals. 6 days off subs.

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    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    I finally called my nanny. Time for my baby to be away from here. Yesterday I couldn't take her to school so she played in my room all day. She had a good time, like an all day picnic. Of course there are fruit loops in my bed but that's a small price. Truly I am deeply ashamed of this. I couldn't snuggle with her last night like she wanted cuz I was so sick. She cried mommy I don't understand! That was an arrow through my heart. It pierced through all my misery like a hot iron. This is my fault. I did this. I deserve to crawl through this river of >>>> to see daylight again.
    And so my day has one good thing to say. Gabapentin. My lord that stuff is great. I'm upright after SLEEEPING this morning. Just got up again. Clonidine and 2 gabapentin are the trick folks. Made me very drowsy. I woke up feeling decent. Who knew?

  16. #16
    thed is offline Junior Member
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    Hang in there! SHould be the worst it's going to get, right? ...Let's hope.

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    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    Thed you may be right my friend. I'm still wearing the lead suit, feeling weak like you do after a bout of flu. But that's the ONLY symptom right now. I haven't had any meds since early this morning.
    So I actually got up and loaded the dishwasher. Picked up the empty Gatorade bottles and Soda cracker wrappers that my spot on the couch has accumulated. I haven't worked up to showering yet. Gross I know but hey it's just me here.
    I am grateful for the fact that I've had no GI trouble. Nausea was my worst fear. I spent a pregnancy like that. I wanted to blow my brains out.
    I am grateful for the most wonderful woman in the world, my nanny. She came on a day she wasn't scheduled and packed my kid a bag. She said see ya when you're better and we love you.
    I am also grateful my teenager is mad at me and staying with a friend. Have to fix that later.
    I am grateful for my job that allows this much time off. They won't be thrilled but I won't get fired.
    That's a good amount of gratitude on such a >>>>>> day. Wouldn't you say?

  18. #18
    Ming23 is offline Platinum Member
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    Nightingaler
    Just hang in there now. There comes a time when we Must be selfish in order to save our own lives. You can do this!
    I wasn't able to shower unless i had help for quite some time. And my spot on the couch sounds like yours!
    So, ur right on track. Stay hydrated. Drink water. Try to eat but if u can't, there's always Ensure.
    Proud of you!

  19. #19
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    Day 4 of withdrawals. Definite improvement but I feel extremely weak. Slept a few hours but my back and ribs absolutely ache if I lay there too long.
    BP is low. Not good. I have drank Gatorade as much as I could but obviously not enough. Called out of work.

  20. #20
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    Any suggestions on making the fatigue better?

  21. #21
    hanker is offline Junior Member
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    Default NightG, I'm with you in spirit...9 days off sobox

    Oh somebody throw me off a cliff. Someone else has to do it cause I can't walk to the cliff. Or to the car to drive to the cliff. Or to find the keys to make the car start...ok you get it.

    Let's see...I was hooked on pain pills from age 19 to 35. Then my at the time fiance drug me to the doc (and I mean sobbing and kicking and threatening to kill him) and I got on sobox. I'm 44 now and just stopped taking the sobox 9 days ago. Yeah...I'm in hell. I had to pull up the calendar to check this but apparently it's Saturday today; I've been in bed since last Friday. So...9 days.

    I've had tiny triumphs: yesterday I took a shower (only possible because my shower has a little seat), put on clothes (and shoes even!) and sat on the porch for a few hours. I texted my friend the whole time and by the end I could hardly stay upright to get back to the bed. Where I fell asleep for hours! This is stunning because I do NOT sleep.

    Things might be worse for me cause I was already deep inside severe clinical depression. I've felt at some deep level that I was heading for a breakdown. And then I ran out of sobox. So...that helped.

    Anyway, hi everyone! I have been skulking round this site for about a decade. I think this is the first time I've posted.

    Sigh, I was hoping maybe I'd be better by now. Oh well, chin up!

  22. #22
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    [deleted - swearing]
    Last edited by Anonymous; 11-12-2016 at 05:37 PM.

  23. #23
    hanker is offline Junior Member
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    Default Same Deal: Secret

    No one knows what's going on with the sobox with me either. The husband and the family and friends just think I'm losing my sh*t, having a complete emotional collapse...which I am. If I started listing all the horrible events that have led to this minute...well there isn't enough cyberspace.

    So, yes! I'm actually relieved to hear you mention the vision problem, cause I've been a little worried. had to zoom my screen into the elderly range and it still gets blurry.

    Let's see, what's the worst? Tie between not even being able to stand up (a few hours ago I got all tough and thought, I'm taking a shower goshdangit [I don't like the no cursing rule; this is the time to really let fly with abominable vocab], so I stood up from bed, staggered around to the other side of the bed, and crawled back in. Ha! Now that is ridiculous. And the other worst thing is the kicky-leg. I'm telling you, this is off the charts. You know that Harry Potter jinx where the victim lies there helpless while their legs kick and dance? That's what I got.

  24. #24
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    Oh I hated that!! Restless legs. I've seen patients with it but I never understood it till this week. My whole body went into that. Are you taking anything to help the symptoms?

  25. #25
    hanker is offline Junior Member
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    Default The LEG

    Well I've tried everything in the med box but nothing works. However I eventually knock myself out for an hour or so till I wake up kicking again. My bed looks like the scene of an epic struggle...which it is, isn't it? I took flexeril (which i hate hate hate but was desperate), took ambien, took ativan. Hmmm...that's all I got I think. Does anything otc help?

    So, I took a shower. Yay! I was feeling all ambitious but by the time I got half my clothes on and was brushing toofs I was starting to weave and stumble. Now back in the bed. But still this is the best I've felt since thurs 3rd. Anyway I was going to try to drive to the pharm to get those supplements listed in the Thomas recipe. and some ensure/boost drink. Maybe tomorrow. What's the gabefleurgen stuff you mentioned?

    You said you quit at 4 mg? Me too basically. I had a tiny taper. 2 days of 2 mg; 2 days of 1 mg. Then out. After ten, eleven years of taking it. Rough.

    I'm using netflix as my crutch. I just leave it on all the time. Between Spotless and 30 Rock I've at least had company. What are u watching?

  26. #26
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    Default Gatorade and Netflix/Hulu is all I need

    Gabapentin is the generic name for Neurontin. It's prescription. I have a handful. Used em sparingly. It's better than Ativan or Xanax for this horror show.
    Speaking of shows. I finished Mad Men last night. I never watched while it was on AMC. LOVED IT. I switched to Hulu to catch up on Superstore. If u have ever worked retail, then you will understand. Now I'm watching a new series on Hulu called The Path. I'm a coulee episodes in. It's interesting so far. Aaron Paul from breaking bad is in it. What u watching?

  27. #27
    hanker is offline Junior Member
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    Default Distractions

    Spotless is really good. On netflix. I like dark gritty emotionally wrenching shows. Oh! The Fall -- awesome. The Killing -- awesome. IZombie is surprisingly good. Shameless is very good.

    For lighter fare, Miss Fischer's Murder Mysteries
    Frazier
    30 Rock

    Oh yes, Mad Men was amazing. I still have the final season of that to watch. and Stranger Things is supposed to be just drop dead killer.

    Ugh, it's getting dark. Can we just fast forward to tomorrow around 3 pm?

    How are you feeling?

  28. #28
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    took a little nap. Just woke up. Feel ok. Other than hurting from laying in the bed for 3hrs. Spent the rest of the day on the couch. My body needs to move or it starts hurting. Moving is not that easy right now. Getting slightly easier though.
    I was wondering. How long were you at 4mg?

  29. #29
    Nightingaler is offline Member
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    Oh btw. If you like dark the path on Hulu is definitely there. It's about a family living in a cult. Day to day stuff.

  30. #30
    hanker is offline Junior Member
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    Cool!

    Yeah I went to sleep too -- left Gilmour Girls playing and snoozed. Then I woke up and felt hungry and was craving pickles!!! So, I've had basically my first meal in a week or so. Half a sandwich and three baby pickles and lots of water. Gah, I'm so thirsty.

    Yes, moving is not fun. I actually walked to the kitchen and stayed upright long enough to make a half sandwich but the whole time I was thinking, "must sit, must sit, must sit now."

    Uh, I have been on 4 mg -6 mg for eleven years. ELEVEN!! And I wasn't planning on going thru this hell but I moved to texas, got no doc here, ran out of sobox, and here we are.

    Here's what troubles me: what is my end game here? With the chronic pain and bs syndromes I've got, it's not safe to NOT be on it. Because the pain I am visited with is ER visit level, so there is no way I can not take something for pain. But if I'm not on sobox I'll feel it...I'll feel the warm fuzzies from the painkillers. And I fear there is no escape after that. I'll just start taking more and more. Ugh. But if I get back on it, I've just devoted a month of my life to this experiment in horror for nothing. Hurv.

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